2.Charlie Adelson - Direct (Continued)
1,620 linesJUDGE EVERETT: Everyone can be seated.
Mr. Rashbaum, you may continue with your examination.
MR. RASHBAUM: Thank you, Your Honor.
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay, Charlie. You're aware of something called "the bump"; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I am.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you're aware that as a result of the bump, a whole host of calls happened after it; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, I promise not to play every call, but we're gonna play some. So at this point in time, permission to publish already in evidence State Exhibit A?
JUDGE EVERETT: Please proceed.
(Pause)
JUDGE EVERETT: Members of the jury, can you hear the audio.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, may we approach?
JUDGE EVERETT: Yes.
(Sidebar conference was had on the stenographic record as follows:)
MR. RASHBAUM: I thought we tested this, this morning, but I guess it's not working. So we have it in the headphones but not on the speaker.
JUDGE EVERETT: Does your audio person need to come over?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I can accomplish that.
JUDGE EVERETT: Okay. Please ask for them to come.
MR. RASHBAUM: Sorry, Judge.
(Sidebar conference was concluded.)
JUDGE EVERETT: Members of the jury, the bailiff is going to take you back to the jury room. We're going to fix the audio issue and then resume.
(The jury exited the courtroom.)
JUDGE EVERETT: Everyone can be seated.
(Discussion off record)
(The jury entered the courtroom.)
JUDGE EVERETT: Everyone can be seated.
Members of the jury, we're going to test the speaker first to determine whether you can clearly hear the audio coming out of the speaker. If you can clearly hear the audio, please give a thumbs-up. If not, you'll have the option of putting back on your headsets.
I believe -- where is their audio -- ability to change their volume levels? Okay.
Does everybody understand how to operate the volume switch?
JURORS (Collectively): Yes.
JUDGE EVERETT: Please test away, Mr. Rashbaum.
MR. RASHBAUM: I will test it first.
(Pause in proceedings)
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. Everyone's good? All right.
So we're not gonna do the screen because that's just causing some more problems. All right.
JUDGE EVERETT: Continue at your own peril, but you may continue.
MR. RASHBAUM: Thank you, Your Honor.
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: So, Charlie, I'm gonna play for you call A. This is a call on April 19th, 2016, at 2:09 p.m. It's the first call with your mom after the bump. Okay?
(An audio recording was published in open court. This transcript should not be considered a verbatim record of these proceedings due to inaudibles and inability to distinguish between speakers. It should be noted that the best evidence of the actual content of the digital recording is the digital recording itself.)
(Audio begins:)
DONNA ADELSON: So, you know, if you have time tonight after work or some other time in the very near future, I'm going to need to speak with you.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Did someone write a letter to you or something?
DONNA ADELSON: I got some -- I got some paperwork hand-delivered to me.
CHARLIE ADELSON: You're being sued?
DONNA ADELSON: No. That's what I thought it was, but I'm going to need to talk to you.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. So, I mean, I could even -- Cinaudible) I have to figure out something Cinaudible) wherever you are --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, I'm in -- I'm in Mitch Klein's office on Oakland Park Boulevard.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So I'm -- right now I'm at Cinaudible), and then I'll be at his office in the after -- in the afternoon.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. So the boys will finish their -- they will finish their piano lesson around 4:00-ish, and it may take me -- depending how bad the traffic will be, I may take a ride with them up there.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Does Dad know about this?
DONNA ADELSON: No. Dad*s at work today, fortunately.
CHARLIE ADELSON: What's Cinaudible) is it the IRS or --
DONNA ADELSON: You know, those IRS people, they kind of bother you sometimes, but, you know, fortunately not now.
CHARLIE ADELSON: I got you.
DONNA ADELSON: So I will talk to you. I'll give you a heads-up if I am gonna drive out that way.
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay? And Cinaudible) --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Do you know what -- does it involve Wendi or anything?
DONNA ADELSON: No, no, no. No, no, no, no.
So let me -- let me just talk to you later and --
CHARLIE ADELSON: What is it? Is everyone's health okay?
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right. Does it involve me or other people?
DONNA ADELSON: Well, probably both of us.
CHARLIE ADELSON: What's that?
DONNA ADELSON: Probably the two of us. So you probably have a general idea what I'm talking about.
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right.
DONNA ADELSON: So let's -- let's just find some time to talk to each other, and I'll take the boys for a ride. Okay?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Are you gonna take the boys up there?
DONNA ADELSON: Well, Wendi doesn't come home -- she doesn't get here until about 7:00, and that's when Dad gets here.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So it's urgent you talk to me today?
DONNA ADELSON: Today or tomorrow. I mean, it's important.
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right.
DONNA ADELSON: I don't know what to do.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, I'll be -- I'll be up at Mitch Klein's office. Do you want to come up --
DONNA ADELSON: Until late?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Oh, yeah, till really late.
DONNA ADELSON: You know, I'm just concerned that I would have to get up there and get back in time for Wendi to get them. Sometimes she gets out a little early. I wouldn't want her to come and them not be here.
(Inaudible)
CHARLIE ADELSON: Can I ask you a question? Who was the paperwork sent from?
DONNA ADELSON: I see, Ben. That's great.
It was something that came hand to hand to me as I exited the building today.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Was it -- was it anonymous or --
DONNA ADELSON: Oh, no. It's not anonymous. It's not anonymous. I just don't want to discuss it over the phone.
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right. Whatever it is, it is.
DONNA ADELSON: I know.
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right. It's silly, but if you want --
DONNA ADELSON: JI wouldn't bother you. Trust me.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah, I know. I know.
Do you want me to come down to see you tomorrow? I actually have the day off.
DONNA ADELSON: Yes, that would be wonderful. Dad actually works later tomorrow. You know, he goes in at 1:00 o'clock. We both work out at the gym from 9:30 to 10:30, so --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Whatever it is, I'll take a look at the paperwork.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: I hope it's not the IRS, but I will --
DONNA ADELSON: I just would like you to review it and to give me some input as to what -- what your thoughts are.
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. So come down tomorrow. Dad leaves at 12:00. So anytime after 12:00 would be good.
CHARLIE ADELSON: 12:00 tomorrow?
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. He leaves at 12:00. He starts at 1:00 there. So 12:00, 12:15 (inaudible) --
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right. I'll come down in the afternoon. That way I can hang out with you and see the boys too.
DONNA ADELSON: That would be great.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Perfect. All right. I'll talk to you later.
DONNA ADELSON: Love you, honey. Bye.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Love you. Bye.
(Audio playback concluded.)
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: Charlie, where are you when this call happens?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm at Skyline Chili eating a bowl of chili.
MR. RASHBAUM: Your mom says that she had some paperwork delivered to her. Do you have any clue what she's talking about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I have no clue what she's talking about.
MR. RASHBAUM: What do you guess?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I thought it was the IRS.
MR. RASHBAUM: What else do you guess?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Is everyone's health okay?
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you think it has anything to do with either your extortion or Professor Markel's murder at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No, not at all.
MR. RASHBAUM: why are you asking so many questions?
CHARLIE ADELSON: My mom -- I've known my mom my whole life. She's talking weird on the phone. She's, like -- like something's -- I can tell something's bothering her, but she's beating around the bush.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, your mom says -- you say, "Does it involve me or other people?"
And your mom responds, “well, probably both of us. Probably the two of us. So you probably have a general idea of what I'm talking about."
And I want to focus on those statements. Okay?
When she says that to you, did you have any clue what she was talking about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I think I asked her a few more questions after that.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, as the calls progress, do you know what she's talking about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: By the time I got to the third -- end of the third call, I knew exactly what she was talking -- I felt like I knew pretty much what she was talking about.
MR. RASHBAUM: By that point in time -- and I want to go back to this line, "Does it involve me or other people?"
Her answer, “Well, probably both of us. Probably the two of us. So you probably have a general idea of what I'm talking about.”
By the end of figuring out what this was, do you -- what did you understand her to be saying here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: By the time I got down to the third call, I realized fully what she was talking about in this call and that she's getting extorted.
MR. RASHBAUM: And so why the two of us?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She knows I was extorted two years earlier, and it's the same people that are coming to extort her for money. So she's saying -- she's trying to say, like, it's the same thing that happened to you is happening to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: And just to be clear, about a month and a half after the extortion of you, who did you tell?
CHARLIE ADELSON: My mom. She's the only person I told.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, when she says, "It's probably the both of us, probably the two of us," you understand the State's theory is that this murder conspiracy was -- in addition to Katie, Sigfredo, and Luis Rivera -- you, your mom, your dad, your sister. Do you understand that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I do now. Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: She doesn't say probably the four of us, does she?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No, she does not.
MR. RASHBAUM: She doesn't say all of us, does she?
MR. RASHBAUM: She says “the two of us"; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, the bump, what was the bump?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The bump was an extortion from a Latin King gang member or actually the FBI pretending to be a Latin King gang member.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, on this call, there's discussion about your dad's schedule. Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Why was it important -- why do you learn later that it was important what your dad's schedule was?
CHARLIE ADELSON: 'Cause my dad never knew what happened to me, and my mom was gonna want to talk to me when my dad wasn't around.
MR. RASHBAUM: If we can go to B, which is a call right after, and it's you calling your mom back.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Sure.
MR. RASHBAUM: May I publish, Your Honor?
JUDGE EVERETT: You may.
(An audio recording was published in open court. This transcript should not be considered a verbatim record of these proceedings due to inaudibles and inability to distinguish between speakers. It should be noted that the best evidence of the actual content of the digital recording is the digital recording itself.)
(Audio begins:)
CHARLIE ADELSON: Hey. How are you?
DONNA ADELSON: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Good. Is it -- is it me not paying the SunPass? I'm just kidding. No, listen. What was I going to say? Do you mind paying my Brown & Brown Insurance?
DONNA ADELSON: No, that's fine.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay. Because I'm going to just stick with the same company.
DONNA ADELSON: They're supposed to shop it for you, you know.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. But the thing of it is, if you stay with the same company for three years, they can then try to bump you down into a lower bracket.
DONNA ADELSON: Oh, okay. So it's a good idea to do that.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So I might as well stay with them and then hope that that's actually true, that they can do what they said about putting it in a lower bracket.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. SO you want me to call Pam Hall?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah, because I told her that my mom would call her because she handles, like, that stuff with the office.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: And then just write -- and then just send them in a check because they have to have it before, I want to say, the 29th or something.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. I will do that now.
CHARLIE ADELSON: And then do that. And, listen, whatever it is, whatever someone sent you, I wouldn't -- I wouldn't worry too much about anything.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: I mean, someone can -- someone can write whatever they want to write. Someone can say whatever they want to say, and I'm not worried.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So was it another bad review on Yelp?
DONNA ADELSON: You Know, those reviews come in, and sometimes they are bad reviews. This is a particularly, particularly, particularly bad one. So you know --
CHARLIE ADELSON: But we're not -- I'm not being sued?
DONNA ADELSON: No, no.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay. All right. Honestly, whatever it is, it is. And I wouldn't -- just judging from what you're making it sound like, I wouldn't stress about it too much.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay, honey. Okay. It is probably nothing, probably nothing.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. Listen, people -- people can always write. People can always say anything they want. It doesn't -- you know, if someone says you're a bad dentist, it doesn't mean you're a bad dentist.
DONNA ADELSON: No, of course not.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So -- but, anyway, I will -- I'll definitely come down. It actually works out perfectly because I have the day off.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. You know, I'll make you take me out to dinner. So make sure you bring cash with you.
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So I need to bring cash?
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. If you take me out to dinner, I want to have --
(Audio playback concluded.)
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: I want to pause it there. You call your mom back and you start talking about the SunPass. Does that have anything to do with this case, the SunPass? Is it code?
CHARLIE ADELSON: SunPass is not code.
MR. RASHBAUM: why do you mention the SunPass?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because two -- couple weeks earlier my SunPass had got stolen out of the car from a valet. I didn't realize it. My parents were getting all these bills, so ...
They make a big deal about little things sometimes. So whatever it was, I was making fun of my mom. I thought she was making a small issue of the SunPass thing.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you then start talking about Brown & Brown Insurance. What's Brown & Brown Insurance? Is that code?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No, no. That was actually the reason I called her back is the last call I forgot to tell her that I had to pay that insurance. Otherwise my insurance lapses. They'll cancel the policy. And it was due. So it was due by the 29th.
MR. RASHBAUM: You then start making more guesses. Is that far to -- fair to say?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. still at a loss for what's going on.
MR. RASHBAUM: You bring up Yelp. You bring up getting sued. Right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Mm-hmm.
MR. RASHBAUM: Again, any clue whatsoever what this is about at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. She just sounded really weird on the first call.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. Then we get to the part that we just stopped, and she says to you, "I will make you take me out to dinner, so make sure you bring cash with you."
At that point in time, what happens to your demeanor? You can hear it on the call. What happens?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I stutter and I repeat back to her what she just said. I was, like, I gotta bring cash with me? Like, it was so out of place.
MR. RASHBAUM: Why -- why did that happen at that point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think she was trying to hint to me that she's getting extorted.
MR. RASHBAUM: So what was odd about you bringing cash to dinner?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I put everything I possibly can on my credit card. That's how I ended up saving up so much cash.
MR. RASHBAUM: And let's hear how you respond.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
(Audio recording published in open court. This transcript should not be considered a verbatim record of these proceedings due to inaudibles and inability to distinguish between speakers. It should be noted that the best evidence of the actual content of the digital recording is the digital recording itself.)
(Audio begins:)
DONNA ADELSON: That's probably a good idea, right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
DONNA ADELSON: Yes.
CHARLIE ADELSON: I should -- I should bring cash? I don't have much cash to bring.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. I'°11 -- okay. I'll see if I have money for dinner. We'll see. we'll see what I have here. Okay?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Was it -- can I ask you, Is someone blackmailing you?
DONNA ADELSON: Well, that's always a good possibility.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Do you think someone is trying to blackmail you?
DONNA ADELSON: Maybe. Could be. I don't know.
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. That's crazy.
DONNA ADELSON: (Inaudible)
CHARLIE ADELSON: Is there -- I don't know what anyone would blackmail you for. But is there any way I can see you? You can't come up here at all?
DONNA ADELSON: It's gonna be difficult because they don't finish their -- the piano teacher doesn't leave until about 4:15. And even if I came up there and got there a little after maybe 5:15, it would still be tough to, you know, necessarily get back here in time for Wendi to pick them up.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Was this -- can I just ask you this? Was it -- is this anything government related, or is this, like, a whack job writing a letter to you?
DONNA ADELSON: Like who?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Is it, like, a whack job writing a letter to you, or is this government related?
DONNA ADELSON: No, I don't know if it is government related. (Inaudible).
CHARLIE ADELSON: So it's not government or military or anything like that?
DONNA ADELSON: No, no, no.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Who is the letter addressed to?
CHARLIE ADELSON: To you?
DONNA ADELSON: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's crazy.
DONNA ADELSON: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Did it have a -- do you know who sent it to you?
DONNA ADELSON: I have a pretty good idea. I have a pretty good idea. But, you know, we'll talk -- we'll talk later. Either -- I mean, I would like to -- I would like to try to get to see you today. I will definitely -- I just don't know if I'm gonna get back here in time for Wendi, and I don't want to have (inaudible) somewhere else.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Is it -- so whoever sent you the letter sent you an anonymous letter?
DONNA ADELSON: No. It's not really anonymous.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Did they sign it?
DONNA ADELSON: It's hand-delivered, Honey.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So someone showed up. Was it, like, by a process server?
DONNA ADELSON: That's what I thought he was when it happened.
CHARLIE ADELSON: It wasn't?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Where did they -- where did they come to you at?
DONNA ADELSON: When I walked out of the building and I make a right and I go past both driveways of the Icon --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Right.
DONNA ADELSON: -- and I'm on the sidewalk, and I'm about five feet from pressing the button so that I could cross the street to pick up the boys this afternoon.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Right.
DONNA ADELSON: And just as I got on the sidewalk --
Okay, sweetie. So you stay -- you stay right here. Okay?
(Audio playback concluded.)
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: So let's talk about this call. You ask your mom, after she tells you to bring cash, "Is someone blackmailing you?" And she says, "It's a good possibility.”
Now what are you thinking?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm starting to evaluate, you know -- I still don't have an idea, but I was -- I was extorted 21 months earlier, so I'm starting to evaluate is it related to that or what could it be.
MR. RASHBAUM: And are you growing more concerned?
CHARLIE ADELSON: very. Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you ask her who the letter was addressed to. why do you ask her that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I was the one who was extorted 21 months earlier. I had no idea why it would be going to my mom if it was related to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you then mention the possibility of seeing your mom tonight, and she doesn't want to see you tonight. why doesn't she want to see you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because she is watching the boys and she didn't want wendi to ask her where were you and have to tell her, you know, what's going on.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, again, I thought, according to the State's theory, Wendi is a co-conspirator in this case; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's part of the theory.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you then say on this, "Is the person threatening you or anything?"
why are you asking that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because on the night of the 18th, I was told, if you don't pay in 48 hours, you are gonna get killed. So I was trying to compare it to what happened to me to see is this related to what happened to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: You later tell her that your advice to her is gonna be to go to the police. Why would your advice to her be to go to the police at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: "Cause I don't think it's related to what happened to me. when I asked my mom, Are they threatening you, she was, like, well, maybe. You don't know how to interpret these things. I'm, like, it was very clear what the threat was to me on the 18th.
So, like, okay. Then it's something unrelated to -- at that level of seriousness. Maybe it's something involving code enforcement or OSHA or somebody messing with them. So I just, like, all right. Just go to the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, towards the end of the call, you say, "Tt wouldn't be the first time I'm being threatened." Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: What were you referring to?
CHARLIE ADELSON: when I was -- when I was extorted 21 months earlier, I was threatened. So I was trying to compare it to that to see is it possibly related to what happened to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: At the end of this call, do you know what is going on yet?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No, I don't know what's going on.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's go to the third call, which is 12 minutes later, and this is C. And this is -- this is at 3:00 o'clock p.m. between you and your mom.
(An audio recording was published in open court. This transcript should not be considered a verbatim record of these proceedings due to inaudibles and inability to distinguish between speakers. It should be noted that the best evidence of the actual content of the digital recording is the digital recording itself.)
(Audio begins:)
DONNA ADELSON: Hey, Charlie.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Hey. Sorry about that. Quick question for you -- oh, one thing I was going to tell you is obviously don't talk about things in the apartment or anyplace.
DONNA ADELSON: Oh, obviously.
CHARLIE ADELSON: The other thing is, was the person black, white, Hispanic?
DONNA ADELSON: white.
CHARLIE ADELSON: And they just -- they just came up to you and they said your name, and they handed you a piece of paper?
DONNA ADELSON: No, no. Didn't hand it right away. First spoke to me for a while, and then -- and then handed it to me.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Really?
DONNA ADELSON: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: And were they wearing a hat and sunglasses or --
DONNA ADELSON: No, nothing. Nothing. I could describe him to a T.
CHARLIE ADELSON: What's that? You could --
DONNA ADELSON: Describe him to a T. No, no, nothing.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Was the person nervous, or were they angry or --
DONNA ADELSON: No. Calm as could be. Totally calm.
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's really crazy. Are they -- are they trying to ask for money or something?
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah, yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Is someone trying -- I mean, listen, if it is something like that, it sounds probably like you go to the police, but --
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. I may -- I may have to. But, you know, I'd rather talk to you first and then --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I mean, I wouldn't -- I wouldn't -- you know -- you know, there are scumbags out there all the time that try to do stuff like that.
DONNA ADELSON: Oh, I know. I know.
CHARLIE ADELSON: SO --
DONNA ADELSON: That's why, you know, I just want you to see because I don't want -- you know, I don't want your father upset, so --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Don't -- can you -- don't say anything to Dad until I take a look at it because Dad flies off the handle --
DONNA ADELSON: Absolutely.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- on everything.
DONNA ADELSON: Absolutely. That's why I suggested after he goes to work tomorrow.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Did the person give you any kind of, like, timeframe or anything?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay. I -- I'm going to be out there.
DONNA ADELSON: But it's clear -- it’s clear what's wanted.
CHARLIE ADELSON: What did -- can I just ask you what did they ask for?
DONNA ADELSON: You know, I don't know. This TV is probably -- the TV is probably about five.
CHARLIE ADELSON: They asked you for $5,000?
DONNA ADELSON: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's fucking crazy.
DONNA ADELSON: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah, I --
DONNA ADELSON: They mentioned, you know, like, an ex-girlfriend.
Hi, Sandra. Come on in. Good. How are you? Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's crazy. I don't know. Let me -- let me take a look at it.
DONNA ADELSON: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: And then I‘'11 -- and then I'1l1 go from there.
DONNA ADELSON: Lincoln, your turn. Your turn. Lincoln is going first. Okay. Do that one.
Yeah. That would be great.
(Audio playback concluded.)
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, in the 12 minutes before this call, had you started to put the pieces together and figure out what was going on a little bit?
CHARLIE ADELSON: A little bit. I was thinking about the first call and the second call, and the more I thought about it, I thought this is related to what happened to me. Somehow this is related to it.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what does your attention shift to in the very beginning of this call?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I wanted to compare it to what happened to me 21 months earlier to see are these the same people that are -- that are doing this.
MR. RASHBAUM: And so the first question you ask -- Were they black, white, or Hispanic? -- why do you ask that question?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I -- I always suspected that it was Sigfredo that did it. I mean, I thought -- in my head that was my first guess, and that's who I would have guessed it was. When I met him, he was -- he was an angry guy, and I was trying to see is this somebody -- is this somebody fitting his description that's maybe coming to my mom and doing this.
MR. RASHBAUM: why do you ask her did they give you a time frame?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because that night I was told you got 48 hours to pay up. I'm trying to compare it to is this person telling my mom you got 48 hours to pay up.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, she says no, but it is clear what is wanted. Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And then she says, "This TV is probably about five.”
Now, before we get here, in the very start of the call, you say, "Don't talk about anything in the apartment or anyplace."
why do you say that to your mom?
CHARLIE ADELSON: well, I -- that was one of the first things I told her when I told her what had happened to me when I got extorted and was picking up the checks from her is to never talk about it with anybody. Do not talk about it on the phone. Don't talk in the apartment. Is that there's always a chance that the police are listening.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what would you be afraid the police were listening to if you didn't do a murder?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I never wanted anyone to know I was extorted.
MR. RASHBAUM: Why didn't you want the police to know you were extorted? what would happen if the police knew you were extorted?
CHARLIE ADELSON: They would -- they would come talk to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what would happen if they came and talked to you? What did you think would happen at that point?
CHARLIE ADELSON: If they came to talk to me, if I decided to talk to them, I'd have to tell them what happened to me. And if I told them what happened to me, my life would be in danger. These people would come find me. They'd find someone in my family. They don't care.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, going back to the TV comment where she says, "This TV is probably about five."
Did you have code words with your mom that TV -- I think they said --
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you have that sheet what TV equals?
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: Did TV -- was it a code word?
CHARLIE ADELSON: There is absolutely no code word involved in TV whatsoever.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, by the way, your response isn't, no, it's an air-conditioner. Your response is, "They want $5,000?"
Was there any code there?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Not at all. I just wanted to clarify what was being said to me, to repeat it back.
MR. RASHBAUM: Your mom then brings up that they brought up an ex-girlfriend. Do you remember that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, Ms. Cappleman in her cross-examinations went through how you had several ex-girlfriends after Katie Magbanua. Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did any of your other ex-girlfriends become involved in a situation where you were extorted?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'd only had one ex-girlfriend who's friend extorted me.
MR. RASHBAUM: So once she brings up your ex-girlfriend, did you have a pretty good idea of what was going on?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Oh, I knew exactly what was going on at this point -- well, almost exactly what was going on.
MR. RASHBAUM: By the way, also during this call, you again remind your mom not to say anything to your father; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: At the end of this call, what do you decide to do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm gonna give Katie a call.
MR. RASHBAUM: And why are you gonna reach out to Katie?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I want to see if her friend's extorting my mom that she knows of it because she sure knew when it happened to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: We're gonna now publish D, Your Honor, already in evidence.
JUDGE EVERETT: You may.
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: And this is a call between you and Katherine Magbanua at 4:27 p.m. on that same day; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you want to use your headphones.
(An audio recording was published in open court. This transcript should not be considered a verbatim record of these proceedings due to inaudibles and inability to distinguish between speakers. It should be noted that the best evidence of the actual content of the digital recording is the digital recording itself.)
(Audio begins:)
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Hello?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Hey. What's going on?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: What's up?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Are you someplace you can talk to me?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: What?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Are you any place that you can talk to me?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: You can talk to me now.
CHARLIE ADELSON: What's that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Just talk right now. We can talk.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay. Can you go somewhere that it's not loud while I'm talking to you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I can't. It's, like, loud, but, like, I can't get out.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay. I'm trying to walk outside to talk to you. Now, I can't even fucking get outside. All right. Let me -- all right.
Somebody -- hang on, okay?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Huh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Can you hear me okay?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I can hear.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay. I just want -- I just want you to listen to me, and I'll be able to talk to you in person when I see you tomorrow.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I don't know what's going on.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: But my mom walked the kids -- evidently -- I only heard part of the story, and I'm going to go down there and talk to her tomorrow to find out what's going on.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: She didn't want to elaborate --
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- but she said that someone approached her on the street --
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- called her by name --
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- handed her an envelope with something in it.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: And somebody was -- she really wouldn't go into detail. And, listen, I don't -- I have no idea what this is in reference to.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: But something regarding her son, something regarding his ex-girlfriend, and the person's asking my mom for some money.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: What?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. So I said -- you know, I'm like -- first, when she was saying it, I thought it was, like, something involving the IRS or a patient suing (inaudible) --
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- or something like that. So I don't even know what the fuck it's about at all.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: So somebody just, like, bumped into your mom like that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, they came up to her on the street after she dropped the kids off at school.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: I guess she brought them to school. I don't even know. But they must know her routine and must know who she is 'cause --
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yeah, (inaudible).
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- they walked up to her and they called her by name.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: They handed her an envelope.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: And she said they spoke to her for a few minutes.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: (Inaudible).
CHARLIE ADELSON: And then she said there was -- you know, they were making reference to my ex-girlfriend, which I have no fucking clue what that's about.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: And then they explained that they needed to be paid some money.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: For what?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I don't -- I don't even know. My mom didn't even want to talk to me on the phone. (Inaudible)
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: But, like, did she see the person? Was she, like -- she should call or something --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Oh, yeah. I said -- that's what I said. I said if someone's gonna try to blackmail you or something --
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Exactly. (Inaudible) like that.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- or (inaudible). I said, You gotta go straight to the police.
So she's, like, I don't even know what this is about. I don't -- I don't want to talk about it.
I go, Well, take a picture and send me what it is.
She's, like, I just want you to see it in person.
So I'm gonna go down -- I can't even fucking go there today 'cause I won't get out of work till 10:00 o'clock at night.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So she's, like, just come down (inaudible) --
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Is somebody, like, stalking your mom?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I don't even fucking know. I don't know what's going on, what my mom is (inaudible) -- you didn't do anything with my mom. I mean, you guys --
(Audio playback concluded.)
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: Let me pause it right there.
You say -- and I quote -- "I mean, you didn't do anything with my mom."
CHARLIE ADELSON: I did say that.
MR. RASHBAUM: What were you asking her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Are your friends extorting my mom that you know of? Are they up to this?
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, during this call you say, "I have no idea what this is in reference to."
why do you say that to Katie?
CHARLIE ADELSON: This -- I'm calling her up and talking about something that she'd asked me to never talk about, and I never planned on talking about it. So I wanted to let her know that I wasn't setting her up and that I -- I needed her help. That's why I was calling her up.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you make reference to an ex-girlfriend, but you're kind of wishy-washy whether she's the ex-girlfriend. why?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I was implying it was her, but I didn't want her to feel like I was setting her up.
MR. RASHBAUM: She says to you when you say, “I mean, you didn't have anything -- you didn't do anything with my mom," she says, “What would I do with your mom?" And you say, “Just checking."
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Katie seem surprised on this call?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Very.
MR. RASHBAUM: How did that make you feel?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That made me feel good. It made me feel like it wasn't her -- her friends that were doing it. I mean, she knew what had happened last time. She definitely wasn't acting surprised.
MR. RASHBAUM: What was your level of concern at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: It was probably medium. I was still pretty concerned what -- my mom didn't sound right on the phone.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, there's a call that occurs after this call that is not in evidence where Katie calls you back. Do you recall what Katie wanted you to do when she called you back?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She wanted me to go down there that night to see my parents.
MR. RASHBAUM: And did she seem very concerned?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She was -- she was extremely concerned when she called me back.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you go to see your mom that night?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I finished work probably after 10:00, and I went down there the next afternoon.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. So let's talk about the next day. So just to be clear, the bump happens and these calls happen on April 19th, 2016; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: We're now at April 20th. Where did you meet your mom?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I met her in the lobby of the building.
MR. RASHBAUM: And did you go anywhere with her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. we went for a short walk and ended up sitting on a bench.
MR. RASHBAUM: What time approximately did you get to Miami and see your mom?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'd say, like, 1:30-ish.
MR. RASHBAUM: why did you meet her then?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because she wanted to wait for my dad to go to work.
MR. RASHBAUM: Where did -- when you walked to this bench outside of a restaurant called Monty's -- right? -- not far from a restaurant called Monty's?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. It's right next to Monty's actually.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you notice anyone following you?
MR. RASHBAUM: As you sit here today, do you know that you were being followed?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Today I do, yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, I think State's Exhibit 54 has been put in evidence. It‘s a picture of you and your mom on that bench outside of Monty's. Is that a fair depiction of where you were?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah, where we were sitting.
MR. RASHBAUM: There's been testimony, I think by Special Agent Sanford, that you and your mom were whispering or trying not to be heard. Is that testimony true?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I mean, we wanted some privacy for sure.
MR. RASHBAUM: And how was your mom acting?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She was very scared.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did she tell you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: well, she told me that she went to go pick the boys up from school and that this really big guy came over to her and said that, You've been helping out Katie and Tuto, and my brother Tato is going through a hard time. He's incarcerated. And my brother Tato did a big favor for you, and you need to do what's right. You need to take care of my brother Tato.
My mom was, like, I don't know what you're talking about. The guy handed her a copy of an article, and it had $5,000 written on it, and it also had a cell phone written on it.
MR. RASHBAUM: At this point in time, did you have any clue whatsoever who Tato was?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I've never heard of Tato in my life.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. So let me make sure that we're all on the same page.
You knew who Tuto was; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Tuto is Sigfredo Garcia.
MR. RASHBAUM: But you had no idea of anyone named Tato or Luis Rivera; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Never heard that name before.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did your mom show you the paper that was given to her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, she did.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall if you took the paper with you or whether you wrote down the phone number from the paper?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I don't know whether I took the paper with me or I just took a piece of paper and wrote the phone number down to the paper. One of the two, but I did have the number with me when I left.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, at this point in time when you're meeting with your mom, what was she concerned about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I mean, she was concerned that she was -- she was gonna get hurt and that they were gonna hurt her, and then someone else in the family was gonna pay, and she wanted to go to the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did you tell your mom in response? What was your theory at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I was telling my mom, This is so different than what happened to me. I said, you know, it could -- I was actually thinking it could have been Sigfredo Garcia because him and Katie were in this explosive fight, and I always suspected that it was him and that he's now extorting my mom and that's what it was. So I thought it could be that. That scared my mom a lot.
But then I said, you know what, This is probably the police. I said it's -- you know, they're not telling you 48 hours or you're gonna get killed. They're not hiding who they are for the first -- you know, even at that point I only suspected Sigfredo. This guy is not even hiding who he is. He's not wearing a hat. He's not wearing glasses. He's not trying to conceal himself.
You know, the first time I wasn't given a cell phone number. This time they're giving cell phone numbers. They're giving names. They're giving all this information. I'm, like, Mom, I think this is -- I think this is the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did you tell your mom you were gonna do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I told her that I was gonna go ahead and go talk to Katie and see if she thinks that this is possibly -- if this is Sigfredo, who I suspected. And if it is, see if she can get him to stop.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, did your mom during this meeting tell you anything about your dad?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did she say?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She was -- she was really worried that her safety was at issue now. And my dad's with her all the time, and she's, like, Look, I know you don't want me to say anything to Dad, but I have to say something to him. Like, this has -- this has gone too far. I can't not.
So I told her, I said, If you tell him, you gotta promise not to say anything to wendi. Please do not let him go to the police. Like, this is gonna -- you're gonna put my life at risk. You're gonna put your life at risk. Like, let me just figure out if Katie can get these people to stop if she is related to them somehow and identify them and get them to stop.
MR. RASHBAUM: why were you so adamant that they not tell Wendi -- that she not tell Wendi?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I thought wendi would go to the police, and I thought my dad would too, but my mom swore that she'd be able to get him not to go.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did you tell your mom about what you would do with your dad after she told him?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I said, After you tell Dad what's going on, I said, I'll be happy to have him come over my house or I'll meet him. I'm sure he's gonna have a whole bunch of questions, and I'll talk to Dad tomorrow.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, after you left your mom, what did you do next?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I left, and then I drove up to see Katie. She was probably working -- she was working for a real estate company, and it was about 15 minutes away from my parents‘ place.
MR. RASHBAUM: And I think we heard the calls. I'm not gonna play them again.
Did you call her to find out the address and where to meet her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I got the address, and then I called her again as I was pulling into the plaza because I'd never been there before, and she walked out of the -- the office that she was working at.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. Now, when you got to her -- by the way, her -- where she was working, was it in a strip mall?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: When you got there, where was she?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She was standing in front of the -- I think it was Optimar Realty. She had just come outside, so she had waved me down.
MR. RASHBAUM: And did you go straight into the restaurant, or did something happen before you went into the restaurant later?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She came -- she walked over to the car. I pulled up into a parking spot. She walked over to the car. I just -- I wanted to talk to her, so I said -- I said, Hop in the car. I need to talk to you.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, did you know that you were being followed?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No, not at all.
MR. RASHBAUM: When she got in the car, what did you learn and what happened?
CHARLIE ADELSON: well, you know, she asked me what happened to my mom, and I told her. And I said -- I said -- I said, Do you think -- do you think this is T?
You know, I said -- well, I said, Was this -- was T behind what happened to me?
And she -- she looked at me and she said, Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what did you ask her about the information your mom had received when she was approached on the street?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I asked her if she thought that this was T that was -- you think he's doing this to my mom, you know, ‘cause you guys are fighting?
Like, a week or so earlier, they had this explosive fight because she saw his phone and some girl was sending him text messages of a tattoo that she just got at, like, 3:00 in the morning. So they were, like, breaking up, and now that my mom's getting extorted and she's having a fight with him, I'm suspecting that it's him.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you bring up the name Tato?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: What happened when you brought up the name Tato?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I said -- I said, Have you ever heard of some guy Tato? Like, you know, I thought it was a joke that there's a Tuto and a Tato.
Like, Have you ever heard of Tato?
And she -- then she started talking.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did she say?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She said, Yeah, I know -- I know Tato. Tato is Tuto's best friend. And she said he's -- he's a bad dude. He's the head of the Latin Kings.
She said they went up to Tallahassee, and he's the one -- he rented a car. He's the one who did this to Dan.
And all -- so my head's, like -- I'm freaking out ‘cause this is the guy that's now extorting my mom. And I'm, like, Katie, is this guy incarcerated? Like -- and she, like, yeah.
Like, does he have brothers?
She said, He's got four or five brothers, but he's got a couple hundred brothers in the Latin Kings in Miami.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's stop there for a second.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: So why did you ask her if he was incarcerated?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because the guy who came up to my mom said my brother Tato is incarcerated. He's going through a hard time, and he needs your help. You need to take care of him the way you're taking care of Katie and Tuto.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, when Katie is telling you that there is a Tato, that he's the head of the Latin Kings, that he's incarcerated, and you know he has brothers, what starts going through your mind?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Oh, shit. This is real. This is -- this is real extortion, and it's happening again.
MR. RASHBAUM: What does Katie tell you about what happened in Tallahassee and who did what?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She told me that T was high on drugs and got fast food and --
MR. RASHBAUM: I'm gonna interrupt you for one second just to make it clear to the jury. I'm gonna ask you -- I know she used their nicknames.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. Make that clear. But for the purposes of today, let's use their names --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay.
MR. RASHBAUM: -- so that there's no confusion.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay.
MR. RASHBAUM: I understand in the car she used nicknames -- either Tato, Tuto, or T -- but just for the purposes of today, use their names.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. what did she tell you about who did what in Tallahassee?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She said that Sigfredo was high on drugs at the hotel and that Luis Rivera was the one who shot Dan.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, did she tell you that Tato was also behind your extortion or no?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She said that Sigfredo brought him to go do this and that it was -- he got paid, but it was -- the extorter was Sigfredo.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did she describe to you -- you said she described to you about a rental car. Did she describe to you anything about the payments the next day?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did she tell you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She said when she brought the money -- she met up with them, and she gave the money to Sigfredo and him and that she didn't touch any of it, and that she didn't take a single dime for herself or anything like that.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, when you're hearing this in the car -- by the way, how long do you think you were in the car for?
CHARLIE ADELSON: 10 to 15 minutes. Probably closer to 10.
MR. RASHBAUM: How are you feeling, and what do you now want to do when you're in the car?
You've just told your mom that you think it’s the police and it's all gonna be okay. Now you've heard that there is a real Tato.
How are you feeling, and what are you thinking about doing at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm freaking out because I thought it was Sigfredo. Then I'm hearing all this stuff about this guy Tato whose name is Luis Rivera. Everything's seeming real. I was extorted. Now my mom's getting extorted.
Katie's telling me she doesn't think it's Tato or his people. He wouldn't do it like this. He would have done it the way it happened to me. She's telling me that she thinks it's a copycat of the -- of one of maybe -- one of Tato's -- someone who knows Tato and is doing a copycat on him and doing their own extortion, or it's probably -- she thinks it's the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, how is she acting in the car?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She's upset. She's very upset.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you've told her that they used her name; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: (Nodding the head)
MR. RASHBAUM: What do you decide to do after she tells you this bombshell information?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, I mean, I -- I had more questions than answers when I got done -- when I got done talking to her in the car, I was more confused than ever. And I told my mom, I'm gonna talk to Katie and see if her friend is behind this and if she can get him to stop, and now it's, like, opened the door to all these other possibilities and scenarios of what it could be and what to do.
So Katie was the only person on the planet that I could talk to about this and see if I can try to get it to stop. So I said, Katie, do you want to go inside and get some coffee, and I thought I would be able to talk to her more and try to see what are we supposed to do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, we know you like to talk. How about when you're scared and trying to figure things out?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I mean, I was freaking out. I mean, I was freaking out, and I'm trying to figure things out by talking out different scenarios out loud. Thinking if it's this, we do this, or if we do this, what'll happen. Or if we do this, what'll happen. And that's why it's a -- a lot of it's very jumbled up because I'm all over the place.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. So you decide to go inside and get coffee. Katie agrees with you. And is that when you go into the restaurant called -- and I always get the --
MR. RASHBAUM: I pronounce it wrong, Your Honor. I'm sorry.
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: -- Dolce Vita?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, it is.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. When you went into the restaurant, who did you think was behind -- well, let me start by saying something else.
You've seen the audio of you in that restaurant -- right? -- with Katie?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Before that audio started, had you met with Katie in the restaurant for about 20 or 30 minutes?
CHARLIE ADELSON: we'd had been in there about a half hour talking.
MR. RASHBAUM: So that audio doesn't capture anything in the beginning of your conversation; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, let's talk a little bit about the beginning of the conversation. Obviously it's many years ago. You're not gonna remember word for word what was said. But, generally, what was Katie telling you, and what were you telling Katie?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Katie was saying that it's the police. And I -- I didn't care if it was the police. I was there ‘cause it was a bad guy. So I'm trying to figure out, like, is my family really in danger and what should we do, and if they are in danger, what should we do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you know that law enforcement at some point in the conversation started to record you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I thought we were alone.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, your conversation with Katie in the restaurant, how were you talking? Were you talking freely or carefully?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I always spoke to Katie carefully.
MR. RASHBAUM: why was it so important for you to talk carefully to Katie in this restaurant?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because whenever I spoke to Katie, I needed her help, so I never wanted her to feel like I was trying to set her up or set her friends up and -- in that -- in that regard. So every time I said something or phrased something, I was always really careful in how I spoke to her.
MR. RASHBAUM: And, again, at this point in time, did you have any clue whatsoever that Katie was part of the extortion of you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I did not think she was ever a part of it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, the first thing that is caught on the recording is, "If they had any evidence, we would have already gone to the airport."
Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: What were you saying here, and what was it in context to of what had been said before?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay. Directly before that, Katie was talking about it being the police and that she thinks it's the police. And I'm, like, it's fine if it's the police. Like, we're innocent. They're not gonna have any evidence. Like, if we had anything to do with this, I'd be going to the airport right now if what you're saying is it's the police. Like, they're not gonna have evidence to show that we did something that we didn't do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Charlie, without getting into all the details that I did with Agent Sanford, this communication at Dolce Vita happened in 2016. You were arrested in 2022. When did you know that the State thought that you had participated in the murder of Professor Markel?
CHARLIE ADELSON: When the probable cause affidavit was released.
MR. RASHBAUM: And when was that affidavit released approximately?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think it was leaked to the media and I saw it in August of 2016.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you ever try to flee the country?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Never.
MR. RASHBAUM: After August 2016?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Never.
MR. RASHBAUM: why not?
CHARLIE ADELSON: "Cause I wasn't part of a murder. There was no -- they weren't gonna have any evidence to show I was part of a murder.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you say during Dolce Vita --
MR. RASHBAUM: One second, Your Honor. I'm sorry. Lost my spot.
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: Is Dolce Vita a bit of an argument between you and Katie?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah, you can say that.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what is the argument about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She's taking the position that it's the police and you can't pay the police, and I wasn't as focused on the police as I was focused on, well, if it's a bad guy, what do we do? Like, we can't go to the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: why were you not focused on it being the police?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I didn't do a murder. I wasn't -- I wasn't worried if it was the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, if it was a bad guy, what did you want her to do? what did you want Katie to do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I wanted her to reach out to them and see if she could get them to stop. You know, maybe threaten them. Maybe she could pay them. Maybe she could tell them she was gonna pay them. It’s a one-time thing. I wanted to see if she could identify them and get them to stop.
MR. RASHBAUM: why did you want her to do that as opposed to you doing that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She knew who the original people were. She knew Sigfredo. She knew this guy, Luis Rivera. And she'd be the only person who would be able to identify them and get them to stop, and maybe they'd be afraid of her.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, throughout this recording several times you tried to sound tough. Is that the case?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Absolutely.
MR. RASHBAUM: You say, I carry a gun on me; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I said that.
MR. RASHBAUM: [Reading]: "I mean, someone comes up to me -- if someone comes up to me, they'd better be ready to shoot because I'm going to shoot them. Someone come up to me asking for money in my house, when the fucking police show up and there's a doctor -- there's an oral surgeon standing there with a dead gang member in his fucking driveway, they're not gonna come down too hard on me."
Take a break right there. Why are you talking tough?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I want to let her know, like, I've had enough. Like -- and, you know, they're messing with my mom. They messed with me. Like, I've literally just had enough, and I'm trying to send that message.
MR. RASHBAUM: why do you bring up a gang member?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because 45 minutes earlier when I was sitting in the car with Katie, she told me that Luis Rivera was the head of the Latin Kings, and that's who the -- the second extortion was a Latin King gang member who was extorting my -- my parents, which was actually the FBI, but ...
MR. RASHBAUM: Immediately after you say those lines, though, you say, "And I'm not gonna talk anyway."
Why do you say that? You're being tough, and then you say, "And I'm not gonna talk anyway.” Why do you say that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I didn't want to scare her into thinking that I'm some kind of loose end, that at any point was I going to the police. I was making it clear that at no point I was going to the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: You then say, "Katie, this is not like some chick showing tattoos to your man.”
What are you talking about here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That was in reference to their explosive fight that sent her and Sigfredo in opposite directions. And I was thinking that he was behind what had happened to -- what had happened to my mom. I thought he was just sending a third party to collect --
MR. RASHBAUM: And what are you trying to tell Katie to do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm telling her to call this person and to contact them and see if she could get them to stop.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you then say, "They're not going away. I may wish they'd go away, but they're not going away.”
And then there's a bunch of unintelligibles, and there's a line that says that you say, "Well, with a beard or a badge."
Do you have any idea what you were talking about there?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think we were talking about is it a police officer or a bad guy.
MR. RASHBAUM: And, again -- well, who would be the beard?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The beard would be a bad guy.
MR. RASHBAUM: And who, again, was Katie trying to convince you it was?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She was -- she was trying to convince me it's the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, we've seen this conversation live although we can't hear all of it. Are you doing more of the talking or more of the listening?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm doing the thinking out loud and talking.
MR. RASHBAUM: You're not really listening to her at all; right?
MR. RASHBAUM: You again say, “Listen. If a badge comes up to you, tell them, have a nice day, officer."
And she says, “Yeah. No. Perfect."
You say, "If not, I don't talk to cops. sorry.”
And she says, "Yeah. No. Perfect."
What are you saying to Katie here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm reassuring her that I'm keeping my mouth shut, and I'm not going to the police, and I'm not trying to set her up. But I wanted her to -- see if maybe make the payment.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you say, "This person is not" -- this is after her long unintelligible.
You say, "Well, Katie, this person is not going away. They came very equipped with details."
What details are you talking about here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: They know about -- about my payment to her with the checks. They know about the payment.
MR. RASHBAUM: You then go on, on a bunch of long discussions about DNA in a rental car. Why do you bring up a rental car?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because 40 minutes earlier I was sitting im a car with her and she was telling me that Luis Rivera rented a car.
MR. RASHBAUM: And during these long discussions, you're talking about how you don't really know anything. You, Charlie, doesn't really know anything.
Why are you telling her repeatedly that you don't know anything?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm trying to reassure her that I'm harmless and that I don't have any real knowledge of what went on and that, you know, I'm not some loose end that you guys need to go try to clean up.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you then say, "They said the guy's name was Tuo, Tuto -- I don't even know who the fuck it is.”
Did you know who Tuto was?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I knew who Tuto was.
MR. RASHBAUM: Was this you confusing the name Tuto and Tato?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's exactly what it was. I was getting the names mixed up.
MR. RASHBAUM: And she asks you to describe what he looked like; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you say -- some of it's unintelligible, but you say, [Reading]:
"well-spoken, like, polite.
"She goes polite and well-spoken.
"I said did he have -- like, did he act thug, or did he have -- talk with, like, a thick Spanish accent or anything?
"She said no.
"I said, Was he white or Hispanic?
"She said he was white, but he could have been Hispanic.”
Why were these facts important to you and Katie?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I was comparing the original extortion that I had to the person that's extorting my mom to see if they fit the description.
MR. RASHBAUM: And she says, "So recognizable.”
And you say, "With no glasses. No glasses, no hat, very well-dressed."
And she says, "Well-dressed?"
As you're talking about this, what are the both of you trying to figure out?
CHARLIE ADELSON: We're trying to figure out is this related to -- is this real extortion, or is this the police?
MR. RASHBAUM: And what is Katie telling you of why she doesn't think this is real extortion and why she thinks it's the police?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because of how it's being done, and these people wouldn't do it this way. But it still opened up the door to her where she said it could be a copycat and somebody's just trying to piggyback the extortion and make it their own.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you say to her -- every time she's telling you it's the police, you kind of push back. why do you push back?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The whole purpose of me being there with her was not to hear if it was police. I needed her help if it wasn't the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: 10 minutes and 28 seconds into the recording -- not the meeting but the recording -- the following thing is what you say: “They didn't mention my name which makes me think that they don't -- these people only know part of the story or they think they know part of the story."
What are you telling Katie here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm saying they didn't mention my name. They don't even know I was extorted and that they only know part of the story. They know about the checks that my mom was writing to you, or they think they know part of the story. They don't realize that that was payment for an extortion, not payment for a murder.
MR. RASHBAUM: So whoever is doing this thinks that you did a murder because they don't know that you were extorted?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Exactly.
MR. RASHBAUM: And by the way, isn't that exactly what the bump is?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The bump is an extortion.
MR. RASHBAUM: But isn't the bump designed in a way that they thought you were part of a murder, and the responses they got they didn't understand because they only knew part of the story?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's exactly it.
MR. RASHBAUM: You then say, "when everybody was there the next day, did you take any money? It's not like you're driving around in a Bentley, cruising around in a mega yacht. Someone -- he must at some point because otherwise he would have no idea I had anything to do with."
First of all, remind the jury how did you know what happened on July 19th and when did you learn that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: July 19th or July 18th?
MR. RASHBAUM: How did you learn -- how did you know about the money drop? Let me ask that question.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay. Katie told me that the next day she brought the money to -- to Luis and Sigfredo Garcia.
MR. RASHBAUM: When did she tell you that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She told me that in the car 30 minutes earlier.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, when you're asking this question, who is the everybody that you are referring to?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Sigfredo Garcia and Luis Rivera.
MR. RASHBAUM: What are you confirming here and why?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That she's not a part of it. I mean, she's broke. I mean, I -- I was being sarcastic, but I'm, like, you're not cruising around in a mega yacht or driving a Bentley. Like, her card's getting declined in Old Navy, and she's borrowing 300 bucks from me. So I didn't think she was a part of it. I don't think she -- I didn't think at the time that she took any of that money.
So that's why I said it like that is that she -- you didn't take any of the money next -- next day, and they're saying that, like, I'm helping -- helping you out.
So I'm thinking that, like, Sigfredo must have said something to Luis about the little things that I do to help you out with, you know, lending you money. I gave her a car with 150- -- 160,000 miles on it. Sigfredo must have said something to Luis, and then maybe one of his people is now trying to extort my family.
MR. RASHBAUM: And in response what does she say to you? who did she say it is?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She thinks it's the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: And so then you say to her, "It could. It could. I wish that it was a cop playing games."
why did you wish it was a cop playing games?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because then it meant that my mom wasn't being extorted by Latin King gang members.
MR. RASHBAUM: You say, "And I'm not involved."
You recall saying that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: why didn't you specifically mention the word “extortion” in Dolce Vita?
Why didn't you say, Katie, why -- why-- are these the same people that did to me -- are these the same people that are doing this to my mom that did it to me back in July of 2014? why didn't you just say that in this recording?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I was being real careful when I spoke to Katie. I would never say the word "extortion" to her.
MR. RASHBAUM: why not?
CHARLIE ADELSON: "Cause I would get zero help, and she'd think I was setting her up.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what were you most concerned about at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I was most concerned about the gang member that's now extorting my mom and also about trying to get Katie to help me to stop it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Again, you say, "If it's a cop, I'm happy because I've got nothing to hide."
You say that at least three times. why do you tell her that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because she keeps on saying that it's the police, and I'm not worried about if it's the police. I'm worried about if it's a gang member and that's coming after my mom.
MR. RASHBAUM: And as she's pushing back that she doesn't want to make the payment or reach out to the person, you then bring up it's gonna put a spotlight in the investigation. You start talking about the FBI and BBC News.
First of all, what investigation are you talking about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The murder investigations of Dan Markel.
MR. RASHBAUM: And why are you trying to tell Katie that this is gonna put a spotlight on this investigation? What are you try- -- why are you trying to tell her that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm trying to tell her that this is a big deal. Like, you know, if we go to the police on the second extortion, they're gonna catch the second extortion. And when they catch him, they're gonna turn, and they're gonna -- the second extortion is gonna turn on the first extortion.
And then when you catch the first extortion, the police are gonna come talk to us. And then when we tell them what happened, you're gonna be in a lot of danger. There's no way I can talk to the police. So by catching the second, it's gonna turn on the first, and that's exactly what I say in there.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you tell her that you want her to give her -- give the guy the money; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And she again -- and what's her reaction to that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She's, like, You can't pay the cops. They're gonna arrest you. They're gonna think you're a part of it.
MR. RASHBAUM: And so then you give a long-winded explanation of what she can say that won't incriminate herself; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Or make the police come talk to her. So I was saying just tell them you don't know anything.
MR. RASHBAUM: Again, what are you trying to convince her to do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Make a payment.
MR. RASHBAUM: And she's refusing; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: You say, [Reading]: “That's all I was able to come up with. If it's the police, they can't take the money. They can't take the money. They won't even come meet you. If it's this guy, maybe in the back of his -- he knows, Cunintelligible), fuck off, Cunintelligible), and that now he's fucking with his wife. And if he's fucking with him, you fuck with -- you fuck with the king himself, you better kill him because he's gonna be a big problem."
What are you trying to say to her here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm saying that maybe if you go and contact these people, they're gonna know who you are, and they're gonna realize -- they'll know that your husband is Sigfredo Garcia. Sigfredo is about as scary of a guy as you can be. And if Sigfredo has a problem with you, the only thing you could do to stop Sigfredo, if he wants to come after you, is to kill Sigfredo.
So I wasn't talking about killing him, but I was saying, if he knows who you are, he's -- you know, he’s gonna be a big problem. So the only way they could stop Sigfredo is if they killed him "cause he's a dangerous guy.
MR. RASHBAUM: And is that precisely why you wanted her to be contacting this person?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. "Cause they would know who her husband is and they would cut it out.
MR. RASHBAUM: You then say, "And so help me God, if they fuck with my family, it’s gonna be like that Nazi shit because this will be done.”
who used that terminology with you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That was an expression that Katie would use. She would say, like, this Nazi shit, like to go crazy on somebody. And that was a term that she would use, and I just -- I used it back to her.
I just meant -- I was saying, like, listen -- like, I'm trying to sound tough also. So I said, Listen. I'm gonna get somebody to go crazy on this person and get them to stop. Like, this needs to end.
MR. RASHBAUM: You talk -- you say, “I don't care what I have to spend."
Ms. Cappleman asked one of the witnesses, aren't you admitting to doing a murder-for-hire here.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Absolutely not. I'm saying that I'll get somebody to act and go crazy on whoever's doing this and get them to stop. I mean, I'm not a scary guy like Sigfredo Garcia is, so I was trying to sound intimidating.
MR. RASHBAUM: You then say, "He doesn't have any bad feelings toward me, does he? Our paths never crossed. I didn't know that the two of you would be working out.”
why do you ask this?
CHARLIE ADELSON: "Cause I'm saying, like, I've been complying. I've been paying every single month. And it's not like I ever -- I didn't do anything to him. I was -- I was still thinking maybe it could be him that's doing this as I'm saying it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, in the video you see Katie leaving the table for a bit; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: She leaves for about two minutes. And what happens when she leaves before she comes back?
CHARLIE ADELSON: It's probably the first two minutes in the last 45 or 50 minutes that I stopped talking and just sat there and started thinking about everything that we had been talking about.
MR. RASHBAUM: And as you're sitting there and thinking about it, what goes through your mind? What do you realize?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I just started thinking again about how different -- how different this is and that the person's not hiding who they are. You know, there's no, I'm gonna kill you in 48 hours. They're giving lots of information. You know, this -- this is not the same people.
MR. RASHBAUM: When you -- when she comes back, you give her the number; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you remember if you gave her a piece of paper or if she -- do you have any recollection of whether you gave her a piece of paper or she wrote down the number or whether you -- do you have any idea, any memory this many years later?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I think I may-- I think I may have just said it to her verbally or given her a paper. I don't remember sitting here today.
MR. RASHBAUM: And then you immediately start talking about how the guy didn't have glasses or a hat. Why was that the first thing that you started talking to her about when she came back?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I was thinking, like, for two years I had no idea -- you know, nothing was confirmed. The identity was hidden. It was just her friend. Now, all of a sudden, this guy shows up, and he's not even taking the precaution to try to hide his identity. He has no problem showing his face.
MR. RASHBAUM: And at this point in time when she comes back, who do you think is behind this?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm coming around to her way of thinking that it's probably the police and a chance, small chance, that it's some sort of copycat, but more than likely it's just -- it's the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: What do you ask her to do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I still ask her to call the number just in a chance that, like, hey, if I'm wrong and it's not the police and it turns out to be somebody that really is dangerous -- like, I'm betting my mom's life on it being the police. So at least just call and -- call and make it so -- for that peace of mind that I -- we confirm it is what we think it is.
MR. RASHBAUM: At the end of the recording, you see that you're actually joking about something.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Mm-hmm.
MR. RASHBAUM: How do you feel at the end of your meeting with her in Dolce vita?
CHARLIE ADELSON: well, I feel much better. I mean, I'm back to the way I started when I came out there that I was thinking it was probably the police, and I felt even more likely it was the police after I got done meeting with her.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, when you repeatedly say during this recording that you hope it's the police, did you understand that if it was the police, they thought -- they would be thinking that you were part of a murder?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Right.
MR. RASHBAUM: So why were you hoping it was the police?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, I wasn't part of a murder, and if it was the police, it meant there was no danger. Nobody's gonna get hurt, and there's no danger to anyone in my family.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, I'm gonna move on to another topic.
JUDGE EVERETT: Before you do that, members of the jury, does anyone need to take a break? Please raise your hand.
we'll take a brief break for the next ten minutes. We'll resume a little bit after 3:30.
(\The jury exited the courtroom.)
JUDGE EVERETT: Everyone can be seated.
Mr. Adelson, do you need to use the restroom?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm fine, Your Honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: All right. You can step back down with your attorneys if you need to confer with them. We'll get started again in ten minutes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, we're gonna try to fix the computer so I can -- they can see it on the screen which might make things go a teeny bit quicker.
JUDGE EVERETT: Okay.
(Recess taken.)
JUDGE EVERETT: You can go back on the witness stand.
Everyone can be seated.
Mr. Rashbaum, time check. Where are we at in said examination?
MR. RASHBAUM: I'm not sure you want to know.
JUDGE EVERETT: I noticed before you had a script, and it looked like you were a quarter, half the way through.
MR. RASHBAUM: The script is deceiving, but I don't -- I don't anticipate that this will end today. It may.
JUDGE EVERETT: That much more ground to cover. All right. Once we get into tomorrow, how long?
MR. RASHBAUM: I think that will be a better question after today. No. Look, we're -- we're going chronologically; right? So we're -- we just finished Dolce Vita.
JUDGE EVERETT: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: A lot of the -- there area couple of calls I'm gonna play that are coming up, but then I'm gonna play very few calls.
(The jury entered the courtroom.)
JUDGE EVERETT: Everyone can be seated.
Mr. Rashbaum, you may continue with your examination.
MR. RASHBAUM: Thank you, Your Honor.
Judge, at this time I would like to move in Defendant's Exhibit 58 which are selected text messages on July 18th that we discussed earlier.
JUDGE EVERETT: Very well. Any objection from the State other than what's already been made?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: No, Your Honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: Admitted over objection.
(Defendant's Exhibit 58 received in evidence.)
JUDGE EVERETT: You may proceed with publishing.
MR. RASHBAUM: I don't need to publish, Judge. Thank you, though, Your Honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: Very well.
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you remember what you did when you left Dolce Vita?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what did you do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I got in the car, and I called my mom up on the phone.
MR. RASHBAUM: Where was your mom when you called her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think she was at the city park.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, throughout this call, you don't mention Katie's name. Why don't you mention her name?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think I was just always being careful. But, I mean, there was no big deal. My mom knew that I was going to go meet Katie, and I just spoke in general terms.
MR. RASHBAUM: You tell your mom that everything is fine. What are you telling your mom when you tell her that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm letting her know that it's the police because that's -- that's how I left it when I left my meeting with my mom before I went crazy and I heard all about Luis Rivera. I'm letting my mom know, like, everything's fine. It's the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: At the end of this call, there's discussion about cheerleading and Passover. What's your level -- what is your level of concern when you have this call with your mom?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I believe that there is no danger to my family at this time or very minimal.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, do you recall that the call got cut off -- well, let me say it differently.
MR. RASHBAUM: Withdraw the question, Your Honor.
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall that your mom on the end of this call had to call you back?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And do you recall that about ten minutes, five minutes later she did call you back?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, at this point in time, I'd like to play Government Exhibit -- State Exhibit G.
JUDGE EVERETT: You may proceed.
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: And this is a call between you and your mom at 5:06 on April 20th.
MR. RASHBAUM: TI don't hear anything.
JUDGE EVERETT: Test your equipment again.
MR. RASHBAUM: I didn't do it.
Nothing in the headphones now.
JUDGE EVERETT: I think it’s -- I think it's clear on the speakers, but, I guess, play it once again.
Hold your thumbs up if you can hear it clearly in the speakers.
MR. RASHBAUM: How about on the speakers? I know you can't hear it on the headphones.
JUDGE EVERETT: You just want it to be a little bit louder on the speaker you're saying?
JUROR: No. I can hear it there. TI just can't hear it through here.
JUDGE EVERETT: I'm not Bill Nye The Science Guy. I'm not sure why we can't get this to work from call to call, but...
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's see if everyone can hear it without the headphones.
JUDGE EVERETT: Can you turn up the speaker?
MR. RASHBAUM: It"s at max capacity which is lower than my voice as we all know.
JUDGE EVERETT: Except for when you're excited.
MR. RASHBAUM: Exactly.
(Audio recording published in open court. This transcript should not be considered a verbatim record of these proceedings due to inaudibles and inability to distinguish between speakers. It should be noted that the best evidence of the actual content of the digital recording is the digital recording itself.)
(Audio begins:)
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah, I just -- so lI hung out with my friend, and she's gonna sleep on some stuff, and then she's gonna come tomorrow to either my office or Thanos'‘s office and tell me how -- how to --
DONNA ADELSON: How -- Cindiscernible) --
CHARLIE ADELSON: So -- so I'll talk -- I'll talk to her tomorrow which is not so long.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. So you think -- you think she'll be okay? You think everything --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah, yeah. I told her -- I mean, like I was explaining to you that the relationship --
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- go one of two ways. Like --
DONNA ADELSON: Right.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So it's gonna be one of two ways.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: But that's --
DONNA ADELSON: How you want it --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Like -- yeah, you're welcome. So I --
DONNA ADELSON: I -- yeah. Hope your dad has a good day at the office.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Oh, yeah.
DONNA ADELSON: Because I like to -- I like him to have a good night's sleep. So --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
DONNA ADELSON: He works in a long -- a long day, so like maybe he'll Cindiscernible).
CHARLIE ADELSON: But I really would not worry about anything.
DONNA ADELSON: Wait a second. Honey, your little brother's on there. Come here, Honey.
Wait till she finishes, and then you'll go on.
You don't think so?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. No. I Cindiscernible) without a doubt I wouldn't.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. TI hope so.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Things Cindiscernible) I'm not gonna worry about it.
DONNA ADELSON: So you'll be at the office -- you'll be at our office all day tomorrow?
CHARLIE ADELSON: From about 11:00 to probably about 3:00 I'm gonna be gone.
DONNA ADELSON: Oh, really? Done for the day?
CHARLIE ADELSON: well, then I go to Thanos's office --
DONNA ADELSON: (Cindiscernible) All right.
CHARLIE ADELSON: TI hate this area. It's like Ives Dairy and 95.
DONNA ADELSON: Very crowded?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Oh, my God, the traffic. To go from, like -- I mean, literally for me to go from, like -- you know, on Biscaynes to, like, all the way to, like, 95 --
DONNA ADELSON: Uh-huh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- it's the same amount of time it takes me to go from my house to South Beach.
DONNA ADELSON: Wow.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Just east-west. It's --
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- for me to go to South Beach from Fort Lauderdale than to be in Miami and to go to the Highlands -- Cindiscernible)
So all right.
DONNA ADELSON: No. That's the -- they're Cindiscernible) --
I'm pushing as high as I can Cindiscernible) I'm pushing. The old grandma. All right. I love you.
CHARLIE ADELSON: (Cindiscernible) But I would -- I would worry about absolutely actually nothing.
DONNA ADELSON: Really?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I'm telling you. I'm telling you, I would not --
DONNA ADELSON: Well, if your theory is correct. I mean, you know, we don't know that.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, listen. I mean, it's -- you have to realize something. It does them no good.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: At the end of the day, there's nothing -- they're not gonna gain -- they're not gonna gain anything. They're still gonna be in the same situation. It's not like -- listen. It's not like you've ever threatened anybody or hurt anybody, so --
DONNA ADELSON: No. No Cindiscernible)
CHARLIE ADELSON: You know, Cindiscernible) the thing is this, is that they're not hiding who they are.
DONNA ADELSON: Right. Not at all. Not at all.
CHARLIE ADELSON: SO wae
(Audio playback concluded.)
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: When you call your mom back, there's a reference to Harvey. Harvey is your dad; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: There's a reference to hoping -- your mom says she hopes Harvey had a good day at the office. She would like him to have a good night's sleep. What did you understand this to be a reference to?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Oh, my dad's about to find out what had happened to me two years earlier and what's happening to my mom now.
MR. RASHBAUM: You're telling your mom repeatedly in this call that she -- that -- not to worry about anything. Why are you telling her not to worry about anything?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because my mom was worried that if Latin Kings -- that a gang member was gonna come and hurt her or somebody was trying to extort her for money.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you then say, "Not like you ever threatened anyone or hurt anyone," and you say -- she says to you, "Well, if your theory is correct."
What was your theory -- well, first of all, when did you go over your theories with each other?
CHARLIE ADELSON: when I saw my mom two hours before this call was placed.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what was your theory, and what was her theory?
CHARLIE ADELSON: My theory was that it’s the police. My mom's theory was that it's a bad guy and they're gonna hurt someone, and then somebody else in the family is gonna pay the money, and that this is a serious threat and her life's in danger.
MR. RASHBAUM: You then start talking about, again, how there were no threats, no disguise. Why are you telling this to your mom?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm telling my mom this is so different. It can't be the same person. It can't be the same people that are behind my extortion that are behind her extortion.
MR. RASHBAUM: Moving on to State Exhibit H.
Now, State's Exhibit H is a call that's in evidence between Sigfredo Garcia and Katie Magbanua. Do you recall listening to that call?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you obviously weren't on the call initially; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I was never on that call.
MR. RASHBAUM: On the call, you can hear them fighting, and Sigfredo is refusing to make the phone call; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Again, what had you discussed with Katie at Dolce vita? What were you hoping that she would do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That she would at least make the phone call, even though we were pretty sure it was the police. I mean, there's still a chance that you're wrong and this is a copycat who doesn't -- doesn't realize that I was extorted, and they're -- they're running their own extortion off of and chasing down my mom.
MR. RASHBAUM: The next day is now April 21st, and the State put in State's Exhibit J, and this is a 22-minute call between you and Katherine Magbanua. Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Was this the first time that you spoke with Katie after your meeting at Dolce Vita?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, it is.
MR. RASHBAUM: On this call are you asking to meet with her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I want to see her.
MR. RASHBAUM: And how is she responding to meeting with you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She's -- she's blowing me off. I'm trying to have her come to my office. I'm trying to have her come to the second office I'm at. She can't find it in her time to come meet me.
MR. RASHBAUM: And when she seems that way, are you offering to pay for some things for her, like helping her get a --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: -- hotel room in the Keys?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. And that was actually even before the bump. She had asked me for something, and I said, Sure, I'll do it for you. $300 hotel room. But that was before the bump. But, yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, during this call, Katie starts talking about investments in properties. Do you remember that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: When she starts talking about the investments in the properties, at first do you have any idea what she's talking about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I have no clue what she's talking about.
MR. RASHBAUM: so in this trial, there's been a lot of talk about code, and the government has a nice little cheat sheet as to what they believe the various code words were. Did you and Katie ever discuss any code words?
CHARLIE ADELSON: There was never any code discussed.
MR. RASHBAUM: But it's fair to say that when you're speaking on the phone with Katie and when you're speaking on the phone with your mom, you're talking very carefully?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Extremely carefully.
MR. RASHBAUM: And for different reasons; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: So let's talk about why you're talking carefully with Katie. What was the reason why you continued to talk very carefully on the phone with Katie?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I didn't want Katie to think that I was setting her up.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, when you say you didn't want her to think that you were setting her up, at this point in time, you didn't think she was part of any murder or any extortion; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Correct.
MR. RASHBAUM: So how would you be setting her up?
CHARLIE ADELSON: well, she's -- she's tied to the people who murdered Dan Markel, and I'm tied to her. So if I went to the police, I would be calling her up and trying to -- trying to get them caught, and I'd be talking in a much more blunt way.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what are you afraid of if she thinks that you're setting her up? There's probably a couple of things you're afraid of, but what -- what are some of those that you're afraid of?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The number one thing is I'd get killed, that they'd think I'm a loose end.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. What's the number two thing?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Number two thing is I'd get zero help. She would help me with nothing.
MR. RASHBAUM: And help in finding out what?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Who's behind the second extortion of my mom.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, ultimately during this call, you figure out what she is talking about with properties; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: As -- as she goes, I'm catching on to some of her lingo.
MR. RASHBAUM: She says to you, "I was talking to someone. Do you think that would be a good investment? He was, like, no, that is a really stupid -- you should really use your head.”
What did you understand her to be saying? who is the "he"?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, by this time she was back with her ex-husband, and I assumed that person to be Sigfredo Garcia.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you assume her to be saying to you he doesn't want to make the phone call at this point?
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, she says, "But he is going to look into a couple things, a couple of properties, and find out what's going on, and then I'1l1 go from there because you can't just jump into a place you don't even know.”
What did you understand her to be telling you here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She was saying that she's gonna look into it. You just can't pay extortion. You don't even know who the person is.
MR. RASHBAUM: She then says later in the call that she thinks that the property was posted incorrectly. She also says that she thinks it's a false lead.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Mm-hmm.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did you understand her to be saying to you at that point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She's trying to tell me that this is the police. This is not real extortion. And that's pretty much what she was saying -- exactly what she was saying the day before.
MR. RASHBAUM: She says, "It's one of two scenarios. That's what I'm trying to figure out right now."
What did you understand her to be saying were the two scenarios?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, the first one is the police where she's, like, you can't pay the police. And the second one would have been a copycat extorter, but not being possibly Luis Rivera or Sigfredo Garcia.
MR. RASHBAUM: In response, you say, "The thing is, that property came with full listing, everything but pictures."
What are you saying here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm saying that this extortion came with so much information and that that was the thing with the first extortion of July 18th is that I had no information. Even when I guessed, the person wouldn't say -- she said, "No, I'm not gonna tell you."
MR. RASHBAUM: And so the fact that it came with everything but the pictures, what did that make you feel it was?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That it was more than likely law enforcement. I mean, they came with -- they were giving you phone numbers. They were giving you names. They weren't trying to hide who they were. It had to be -- it more than likely was law enforcement, but it's still a small chance it could have been a copycat extorter.
MR. RASHBAUM: 15 minutes and 45 seconds in this call, she says, "I did some research. I will find out more. I don't want anyone to take advantage to you -- advantage of you.”
How was she acting?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Like she was protecting me, like she was trying to help.
MR. RASHBAUM: And, incidentally, what did you think she was doing for you for the past 20 months since the extortion that occurred on July 18th?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I thought she was protecting me.
MR. RASHBAUM: You then start talking with her about other types of real estate. Was this real, real estate at this point?
CHARLIE ADELSON: There was some real talk about real estate "cause she was working at a real estate company.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you tell her that you will lend her money for her real estate career?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. She once asked me, if she ever found a good place, would I lend the money and go in partnership with her.
And I always said, If you found the right deal, I would. But we never -- we never spoke in any specifics beyond that.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you talked to her about helping her out with her car?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Why were you offering to help Katherine Magbanua out with her real estate car -- her real estate career and her car and saying that at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I didn't think that she had -- was benefiting from the extortion of me at all. She always told me she never took any money. Her credit cards were getting declined at Old Navy. She was borrowing money. I thought that she got dragged into this in the same way I got dragged into this.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, the next call that's in evidence is K, and this is April 21 at, I believe, 11:00 o'clock a.m.
MR. RASHBAUM: One moment, Your Honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: Take your time.
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: This is a call between you and your mom; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And this is the first call since the call that we just heard where your mom is swinging the boys at the park; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Right.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, there’s a discussion on this call about meeting with your dad. Why were you gonna meet with your dad?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, I knew that the night of the 20th my mom was gonna tell my dad what had happened to me and what's happening to her now, and I knew my dad was gonna want to talk to me and find out what's going on. So I told my mom, Listen. I'l] talk to Dad when he wants to talk to me tomorrow. Just have him meet me.
MR. RASHBAUM: 50 seconds into this call, which -- again, I don't think we need to play it -- is K. You say, "I saw a lot of police everywhere giving traffic tickets so be careful. Anyway, that's who I think it is for multiple reasons. Multiple, multiple, multiple reasons."
What are you telling your mom here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm telling my mom be careful where you talk about this. I don't want the police to know that I know anything or that I was extorted. They're gonna come talk to you. So, please, maintain your -- be careful. Be careful where you talk.
MR. RASHBAUM: And when your mom responds again on the earlier call, "Well, that's good if your theory is correct," what do you understand your mom to be hoping for?
CHARLIE ADELSON: My mom was hoping it was the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, after this call, you have a call with your dad, and where do you-all decide to meet for dinner?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I was originally gonna just have my dad come by my house, but I was working late, and I told my dad I'll meet him at, like, a halfway point between my place and his place, and I met him for sushi down in Miami.
MR. RASHBAUM: And let's talk about Matsuri. Did you go to the restaurant straight from work?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I did.
MR. RASHBAUM: Who got there first?
CHARLIE ADELSON: My dad was there before me.
MR. RASHBAUM: When you got there, could you-all get a table right away?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. It was 9:00 at night. The place was packed.
MR. RASHBAUM: Where did you go when you couldn't get a table?
CHARLIE ADELSON: We waited for about 15 minutes and told the person seating people that we'll just take a seat at the bar, take two seats at the bar, if you can.
MR. RASHBAUM: Before you got seats at the bar, did you go anywhere to talk with your dad?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. We were -- we put our name down, and we were just sitting outside the restaurant on a bench.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you notice anyone around you?
MR. RASHBAUM: As a result, were you able to talk freely?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Without going into the whole discussion again, what did you discuss generally with your dad?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I told him what had happened to me, and I told him that I thought it was the police that were doing this to mom and that this is just so different.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, was it clear to you when you met with your dad in the -- outside of the restaurant that your mom had told him everything by that point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She told him everything.
MR. RASHBAUM: Was it clear that he knew that this was related to Katherine Magbanua?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, at this point in time -- and I want to emphasize “this point in time" -- did your mom or your dad know anything about Tato being in prison, confirmation that Sigfredo Garcia was the extorter? Did they know anything about that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: well, the undercover had told my mom that Tato was incarcerated. But aside from that, all -- everything that I had found out at lunch the day before or meeting with Katie after I saw my mom I hadn't spoken to my mom about it, so she knew none of that.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, was your dad upset with you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: He wanted -- he wanted to know why didn't I come to him. I said, Dad, I thought, if I went to you, I didn't think I'd be able to stop you from going to the police. I don't think you would have realized the danger that I was in and the family -- you would be putting the family in. So I -- I didn't want to tell anybody. The only reason I told mom was because when I ended up picking up the checks from her is when she found out.
MR. RASHBAUM: He now knows, though. All right. He knows as of the evening of April 20th when your mom tells him, but he knows as of Matsuri.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Does he say to you, Charlie, I gotta go to the police?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I think my mom scared him pretty good.
MR. RASHBAUM: And when you spoke to him, was he behind you in not going to the police?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I mean, he understood why I didn't go. I mean, he understood how serious it was. This was not a small threat.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you tell him outside the restaurant before you go in to eat that you were pretty sure it was the police?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. And I went through all the reasons that we've spoken about that it was -- I was fairly certain it was the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you end up getting seated at the restaurant, and where do they seat you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: They seat us at the sushi bar.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, Matsuri -- it's a pretty authentic Japanese sushi restaurant; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. It's in a strip shopping center, but you go in there, and, like, half the people are Japanese. It's very authentic.
MR. RASHBAUM: At first did you notice anyone sitting next to your dad?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. We just sat at the bar. It was just the two of us.
MR. RASHBAUM: Later did you notice someone?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes. A gentleman comes over and sits down next to my dad.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, before we get into some of the details, did anything initially strike you as very weird about this person who was sitting next to your dad? what was the first thing that struck you as being kind of off?
CHARLIE ADELSON: He was very rude.
MR. RASHBAUM: How was he rude?
CHARLIE ADELSON: well, I mean, we're sitting there and we got our dinner plates. At the sushi bar, they serve you your food, and so your dinner plate's there, and your drinks are there.
And he comes over, and he plops this big bag down right next to my dad's dinner plate, and it’s, like, you don't put your belongings on the dinner table. And it just struck me.
I looked at the guy. He put his belongings down and his keys, and it was, like, sitting next to my dad's plate. I'd never seen that done like that before.
MR. RASHBAUM: And that was off to you; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I just thought the guy was rude. He was off, yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: I want to take you back to before you saw the guy. You've seen the recording. Was there some discussion between you and your dad before the recording at -- at the Jarrett (phonetic) house?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. But the recording starts with you almost mid-sentence saying, "I can even tell you he's at Giant Stadium." Do you remember that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: What are you talking about there?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm saying that -- we're talking about it being the police, and I'm saying the police are just following a lead that's not true.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, are you actually using the word "police"?
MR. RASHBAUM: You then say, "It's not" -- by the way, what's the reference to Giant Stadium?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Supposedly some guy, Jimmy Hoffa, who got killed years ago was buried in the end zone of Giant Stadium. So the police went and dug up the end zone thinking that he was there because somebody said it. So they investigated it, but it was never true.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you then say, "It's not done like that."
What were you telling your dad was not done like that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: It's -- the extortion wasn't done like it was done to me, it's being done to my mom. That's not how it's done.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you do this twice, but at 50 seconds into the recording, you say, "And the funny thing is," and you whisper something in your dad's ear.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Mm-hmm.
MR. RASHBAUM: I know you don't know the exact words, but what did you whisper into your dad's ear?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I was saying that they don't realize I was extorted the first time, and this is the same thing that's getting done. And the second time I say, This is like -- the funny thing is this is like deja vu.
MR. RASHBAUM: we're gonna get to that.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Then there is talk about why they didn't go to wendi. And why did you think they didn't go to Wendi?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think they didn't go to Wendi because the police already spoke to her.
MR. RASHBAUM: And Harvey asks you if Katie agrees with you. Agrees with you about what?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That it's the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: Throughout the video you're seen repeatedly looking at the guy next to your dad.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: why are you looking at him the second time? what piques your attention next?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, the waitress -- the waitress came over, and the first thing he said to her is what kind of salads do you have here. And she even just looked at him. I mean, like, it's a sushi bar. You come here to eat sushi, and it's not a place where you come and you're, like, what kind of salads do you have here.
And then when I looked at him, he looked at me, and then he ordered his salad, and he ordered a California roll. So I was, like, this guy really doesn't like sushi, and he's coming into a sushi restaurant at 9:00 at night by himself. It seems really odd.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you then say again at some point, "And the funny thing is," and it's unintelligible after. Do you think you know what you said at that point?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I said, "This is like deja vu."
MR. RASHBAUM: You're then eating, and you say to your dad, "I think there's a recorder in the bag."
Your dad asks whether they can do that, and you say, "They can with a warrant."
why did you think there was a recorder in the bag, and who did you think was sitting next to your dad?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I mean, the way the guy ordered his food, I mean, he clearly doesn't like sushi, and he's sitting in a sushi restaurant. And then he's sitting there with his bag on a table next to our dinner plate. I've never -- he’s either the rudest guy ever, or he's a -- could be a police officer, or I could be just completely wrong, and he is just a rude guy.
MR. RASHBAUM: And so what happens after, as Ms. Cappleman says, “he was made"?
What happens after you realize that he is a police officer or someone -- you have suspicion that he's a police officer?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. we no longer talk about the extortion.
MR. RASHBAUM: Why don't you talk about it? What would be the problem with the police knowing about the extortion, the first extortion?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The same reason I didn't go to the police the night of July 18th is that I was worried about my life, my family's life, and I bounced back and forth between should I go, should I not go. And every time I went through the pros and cons, I mean, jt wasn't gonna bring Dan back.
The people who did this don't care about killing someone in the middle of the day. I mean, there's not a question, you know, especially sitting here and seeing Luis Rivera come in, and I know who Sigfredo Garcia is. I don't think these guys would have cared. I think they would have killed me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, after dinner you leave the restaurant and you go in the parking lot; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you thought you were gonna just go to your cars. Your dad walks you to your car first, and what happens?
CHARLIE ADELSON: we were just talking, and he's asking me a few more questions, and then I -- he asked me about who's -- who's Tato? Like, what's the story with him? Did Katie know who Tato is?
MR. RASHBAUM: And at that point in time, for the first time, did you tell your dad what you had learned in the car with Katie the day before?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I mean, at this point I'm not holding anything back from my parents, and I told my dad that, Yeah, Dad. Tato is the real person, and he's the head of the Latin Kings of Miami, and he's the one who killed Dan.
MR. RASHBAUM: When you tell your dad that, how does he react?
CHARLIE ADELSON: He's, like, Look. You think it's the police. You know, why not -- you know, maybe you're right; maybe you're wrong. Let's just go to the police now. Don't you think that's the safest thing to do?
And I said, Absolutely not. I mean, these people are connected. They know other people out there. I didn't go to the police originally. I don't want to do that.
And he's, like, well --
I said, I think it's the police, so nobody's gonna get hurt.
And he's, like, well, what if you're wrong?
MR. RASHBAUM: And did this discussion go back and forth for a while?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. Because, I mean, what do you -- what do you say when someone says, What if you‘re wrong and that you're gonna get killed?
MR. RASHBAUM: What did you tell him you would continue to do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I said, Listen. I'm gonna talk to Katie. I'm gonna -- hopefully she'll come by and see me tomorrow, and I'll talk to her and see if she's reached out to these people and see if it is legitimate extortion or if it's just the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you again go over with your dad all the reasons why you were sure it wasn't the police?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That it was the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: I'm sorry. That it was the police.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. At that point I did. I rehashed everything again and went through everything that we discussed.
MR. RASHBAUM: And at the end of leaving the restaurant, what did your dad agree to?
CHARLIE ADELSON: He agreed not to go to the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: The next day, you speak with your mom; correct? This is April 22nd.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I did.
MR. RASHBAUM: This is Defense Exhibit -- I'm sorry.
MR. RASHBAUM: I'm sorry, Your Honor. I'm a little confused. Hold on a second.
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: This call is not in evidence. On this call, just to refresh your memory so that we don't have to play it -- well, let me first offer it into evidence.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, it's labeled Defense Exhibit 100. It's a call between Donna Adelson and Charlie Adelson on April 22nd. It's State Call 1695. We would move it into evidence.
JUDGE EVERETT: Any objection from the State?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Hearsay, Your Honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: Members of the jury, the bailiff is going to escort you to the jury room. I'm going to listen to the call.
(The jury exited the courtroom.)
JUDGE EVERETT: Everyone can be seated.
You can play the call, please.
MR. RASHBAUM: Would you like me to play the full call or just the part that I plan on publishing?
JUDGE EVERETT: Well, how long is the call itself?
MR. RASHBAUM: Let me check.
The call is 15 minutes long -- 15 minutes and 11 seconds long.
JUDGE EVERETT: All right. I believe the context of the call is really going to matter here, but how long is the portion that you plan to publish.
MR. RASHBAUM: I plan on starting at around 5 minutes and 50 seconds in and going till -- I think I can stop it at around 7:30.
JUDGE EVERETT: All right. Go ahead and just start it from the beginning.
MR. RASHBAUM: From the beginning of the call?
JUDGE EVERETT: Yeah. Go ahead.
MR. RASHBAUM: I started it.
JUDGE EVERETT: Well, I guess it's a good thing when you're not hearing voices, but I do -- actually do need to hear the voices to get through this issue.
MR. RASHBAUM: I really hate computers, Judge.
(Audio recording played in open court as follows:)
JUDGE EVERETT: Could you rewind at the beginning, Ms. Dugan?
(Audio recording published in open court. This transcript should not be considered a verbatim record of these proceedings due to inaudibles and inability to distinguish between speakers. It should be noted that the best evidence of the actual content of the digital recording is the digital recording itself.)
(Audio begins:)
DONNA ADELSON: Hey, Sweetheart. How are you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Good. What's going on?
Hey, Dad.
HARVEY ADELSON: How are you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Good. What's going on?
HARVEY ADELSON: Not too much. I got the boys finishing up a computer show.
You finish? Shut it off, Lincoln. Go brush your teeth, and I gotta get Ben.
Ben, go brush your teeth now. Ben, go brush your teeth. All right.
I got Uncle Charlie on the phone. You want to say hello to --
Charlie, hold on a second. Okay?
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right.
DONNA ADELSON: Hey, Sweetheart. How are you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Good. What's going on?
DONNA ADELSON: Oh, you know ... You know ...
CHARLIE ADELSON: Any -- any more drama?
DONNA ADELSON: No. I had cooking day, so got up early and cooking a lot of stuff for the Seder for tomorrow. And then --
No, Ben. Ben, go to Grandpa and get your teeth brushed.
Really? Okay, Lincoln. Go get your teeth brushed.
And then we go to the courthouse with food. Nice. We met Wendi's judge.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Oh, nice.
DONNA ADELSON: She is like your next-door neighbor.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Really.
DONNA ADELSON: She has said that all along. ‘Cause I remember the other judge she worked for. Whoa.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Really?
DONNA ADELSON: Impossible. Very difficult woman.
This guy is like --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Like (indiscernible) --
DONNA ADELSON: No. Just like your neighbor. Just sitting forward, talking, you know, talking about how -- ‘cause one of the guys there, this black guy named Farley, is with a girl now, and he's pretty serious.
So he said, Yeah, (indiscernible) trying to tell him, you know. Secrets of a happy marriage. He says, I'm married. I have 30 years or something, this judge.
He says, Secret to a happy marriage is yes, dear. It always works. He says, Actually what really works is: You're right. Yes, Dear.
So, he said, it's worked for me.
He said, I'm happy. Got two great daughters, you know. My life is good. He says, Sometimes you tread slowly. Practice every day. Yes, Dear. You're right. He said, You'll do great.
So he's -- he's -- he's, like, funny and casual, and it was Casual Friday, so he's just wearing a pair of pants and a collared -- you know, with a collared shirt, very casual shirt t-shirt type of thing. And so friendly. What a ...
It's like Wendi said a genuinely nice guy. You wouldn't think -- you wouldn't think he's an appellate judge. You just wouldn't believe it. So super nice guy. I'm happy for her. It's a nice person for her to work with.
And -- and the other four people, you know, that we met also so nice.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Really.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. In fact, this guy Trinity -- I think Trinity is Wendi's age. I think he -- I thought she told me he used to be a cop, but then he went to law school. Now, he's (indiscernible).
Beautiful job, Ben.
And he, you know -- and he's the one that's married and has two kids, and there's such a difference because, for whatever reason, Ben didn't want the ice cream and cake. So he went back into Wendi's office, and we're all sitting and having cake, and actually that 15 minutes is when Trinity gets up, and before he went to the bathroom -- (indiscernible) so anyway ...
Yes, he did, Honey. He just did. He has an extra -- he has an extra brush in there.
Some things that I was talking -- no. I'm gonna ask him. He said, what's on tomorrow? I'm hoping I'm gonna have a little time with you tomorrow just to talk about some of the cases that we need to go over. So --
Okay. Okay, Sweetheart. Okay. I'll get you one.
So I would like, if that's possible maybe. What do you think?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, I'm waking up early in the morning and driving up to West Palm Beach.
DONNA ADELSON: Well, then, you should. I couldn't remember what you were doing up there.
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm going racing.
DONNA ADELSON: Oh. I knew you were doing something.
Dad said, What's he -- what's he doing?
I said, You know what, I don't remember. He told us he was doing something.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. No. I'm going racing. I got all the guys going up there.
DONNA ADELSON: How many of you are going?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think just four of us.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. Is Scott one of them? Scott Jones --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Who? Scott Radius or Scott Jones?
DONNA ADELSON: Jones.
DONNA ADELSON: No?
What, Lincoln? Yeah. Oh, okay. Tell Ben to get a book and go on to bed with you, and I will be right there.
Okay. I guess I gotta go.
Oh, you can have -- no, not this time, Honey.
Let me -- let me do this with you tomorrow, please.
So you're going up there early. So what is -- what is that, like, about, three, four hours racing or less?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. But, I mean, it's -- you're looking at an hour -- it's an hour and 15 minutes there. It's an hour and 15 minutes back here. And then I'll probably be there for two and a half hours.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So, you know, I'm hoping to get to your place by 5:00, 5:30.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. Yeah. If it doesn't work, maybe -- you know, maybe you're free a little bit later. ‘Cause dinner -- it's not gonna be a late evening.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Or I can always talk to you halftime. It's --
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. That's what I'm thinking.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Can I just ask you one thing?
DONNA ADELSON: Um, sure.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Has there been any more drama?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Zero?
DONNA ADELSON: Zero.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
Did -- did Dad tell you what I spoke to him about?
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah, yeah. (indiscernible) a couple of questions. That's why I wanted a chance to see you tomorrow.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. But it makes --
(Simultaneous speaking)
CHARLIE ADELSON: Makes perfect sense, though, doesn't it?
DONNA ADELSON: Yes, it does. I still have some questions, but I -- I mean, things that I think should be addressed, but, you know, we'll do that tomorrow.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah, yeah. I'll talk to you tomorrow. I mean, Listen. There's no -- there's no rush. I don't start work till Monday.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. Sounds good.
CHARLIE ADELSON: (indiscernible) that's not what I'll be asking you tomorrow.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: But what --I -- I've thought everything through again and again and again, and I think I'm a hundred percent right.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. Well, I hope so. That would be, you know --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Or 99 percent right because none of it -- none of it makes any sense.
CHARLIE ADELSON: None of it makes any sense. I mean, there's no -- it's not -- I'm just telling you it's not done like that. It's not. I know -- I know for a fact it's not. It's not done like that at all. And they -- and they're approaching somebody who has nothing to do with anything which is --
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- earlier.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: So, listen. My -- my feeling is, is that, you know, you go to -- I'll tell you what my feelings are --
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. Let's -- yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: But it's just -- it's utter non- -- it's utter nonsense. That's the best way I can describe it. It's utter, utter, utter nonsense, and I wouldn't pay it any attention. No attention at all. It's not -- it's not done like that. It's flatout -- it's not done like that.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah. We'll talk about it tomorrow.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. No. But, I mean, I can say it -- I can say it on the phone without saying it, but it's not done in such a nice manner.
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. It's not -- it's not done like that.
It's -- it's done -- it's done like that if you want someone to talk to you. If it's -- otherwise it would just be -- it wouldn't have been done like that.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: It's nothing -- yeah. Listen. If you're --
(Simultaneous speaking)
DONNA ADELSON: Let's -- well, let's --
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I'll talk to you later.
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: But anyway that's --that's really what I thought. I think it's utter nonsense --
(Simultaneous speaking)
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Leave it at that.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. All right, Sweetie. So are you going out tonight?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Nah, probably not 'cause I gotta get up. I'll be racing tomorrow.
(Simultaneous speaking)
DONNA ADELSON: Yeah, yeah.
CHARLIE ADELSON: And then do all that.
DONNA ADELSON: Okay. So you're gonna have fun tomorrow. That sounds great.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. No. I'm really looking forward to it, and I'm buying the kart.
DONNA ADELSON: What kart?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm buying a go-kart tomorrow.
DONNA ADELSON: Oh, I thought you were racing cars?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Karts. Kart racing.
DONNA ADELSON: Oh, I thought c-a-r-s. Oh.
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. You can’t rent cars to race. They're not gonna let you rent the car.
DONNA ADELSON: So a kart. So what -- is everybody doing that? They buy karts?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, I'm buying my go-kart.
DONNA ADELSON: So what is everybody else saying --
(Audio playback concluded.)
JUDGE EVERETT: Mr. Rashbaum, is that the end of the portion you wish you publish --
MR. RASHBAUM: Yeah. I would -- focus only -- it's only two minutes. It's already played.
JUDGE EVERETT: All right. With regard to the hearsay objection, the part that really struck my ear was your client saying “it's not done in this way." what is his qualification to essentially make this opinion if this is not hearsay?
MR. RASHBAUM: His qualification is he's been extorted before, and he knows it's not done this way.
JUDGE EVERETT: Assuming there are many ways to skin a cat beyond the one way in which he's alleging to have been extorted, what is his foundation to make this opinion?
MR. RASHBAUM: He's making an opinion based on his past, and it goes to his state of mind. So even though it's hearsay, it's an exception to the hearsay rule, which is his state of mind.
JUDGE EVERETT: State, any further argument?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: No, sir.
JUDGE EVERETT: All right. I am going to sustain the objection. Your client may testify as to any matters he can recall but specifically not getting into the substance of this call itself.
MR. RASHBAUM: Fair enough, Your Honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: Let's bring back in the jurors.
MR. RASHBAUM: May I approach the podium, Your Honor?
JUDGE EVERETT: You may.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, how late are you thinking we'll go tonight?
JUDGE EVERETT: Probably till 5:45. Press on.
(The jury entered the courtroom.)
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: The Matsuri meeting was on -- dinner was on April 21, 2016; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: The next day you have a call with your mother. Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: During that call with your mother, do you recall asking her whether Dad had told her everything that you told him the night before?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Objection. Hearsay, Your Honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: Overruled. He can answer the question just not get into the substance of it.
You may continue. A Yes. I asked her had my dad told her everything that I talked with him at dinner about.
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: And on that call, what, again, do you tell your mom even with what you had told your dad the night before?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Objection. Hearsay.
JUDGE EVERETT: Well, I'm going to allow him to answer the question as long as it's not going to get into an out-of-court statement.
You may answer the question.
CHARLIE ADELSON: That it's not done this way I know for a fact, and I'm 99 percent sure it is what I thought jt was.
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: What was the basis for you telling your mom that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I wanted to -- I wanted to -- I wanted to calm her down and tell her that I'm more sure that it's the police, and the basis was the -- the guy that sat next to us at the restaurant who went to the sushi restaurant and wanted to eat a California roll and was real rude.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. Now, I want to go to April 23rd. April 23rd --
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, may we go sidebar very briefly?
JUDGE EVERETT: Approach.
(Sidebar conference was had on the stenographic record as follows:)
JUDGE EVERETT: Do you have a class to teach tonight?
MR. RASHBAUM: Actually, I apologize. I can do it without playing it.
JUDGE EVERETT: Very well.
(Sidebar conference was concluded.)
JUDGE EVERETT: Please continue in your examination.
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: On April 23rd, you find out later in the day that a letter has been sent to your parents’ home?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The 20 -- the letter -- that was --
MR. RASHBAUM: Your parents received a letter on April 23rd.
CHARLIE ADELSON: It was -- it was on a Monday. Is that -- was that the 23rd?
MR. RASHBAUM: Can we show -- do you have the letter?
JUDGE EVERETT: I believe this was already entered into evidence.
BY MR. RASHBAUM
MR. RASHBAUM: will you take my word that the letter was received by your parents on April 23rd?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Sure.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Like -- I think it was Monday the 25th.
MR. RASHBAUM: Ah, you're right. Don't take my word.
The letter was received on April 25th.
CHARLIE ADELSON: That, I will agree with.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, on April 23rd, did you find out that Katherine Magbanua and Sigfredo Garcia were in a big fight?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah, I did.
MR. RASHBAUM: And did you learn that Katherine Magbanua had left him?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I believe I called her on the phone, and she said she took her shit and left.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, on the 23rd when you find that out, were you upset?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: why were you upset?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, at this point in time, Katie's been protecting me in the first extortion. with Katie being with Sigfredo Garcia, that was the best chance I had to try to stop the second extortion or to find out who's behind it.
And then it also made me think that the timing of their explosive breakup and the timing of the guy extorting my mom and the fact that I had just found out on Wednesday the 20th that Sigfredo was behind what happened to me was very suspicious. So I -- it opened the door in my head to thinking, like, what if Katie -- you know, what if she's breaking up with him because she found out that he's behind the extortion of my mom and she doesn't want to tell me. So my mind was going there.
MR. RASHBAUM: And then two days later the letter arrives at your parents’ apartment; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, on that Monday.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. So let's talk about that Monday, April 25th. Where were you working that day?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I was actually working in the -- that office in South Beach just a couple blocks away.
MR. RASHBAUM: And after work where did you go?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I went over to my parents’ house to stop off.
MR. RASHBAUM: what happened when you got to your parents" house?
CHARLIE ADELSON: My parents were really shaken up because they got a very threatening letter mailed to them saying that, You don't take me serious, and Tato is fucked and soon you will be fucked too.
And it was mailed to their apartment, so now they're saying, if they were doing this, they know where we live. Not just the building. They know the apartment number. Like, they were scared.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did your parents think that the letter was more threatening or less threatening than the original communication on the street?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Way more threatening.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what did you do after you found out about the letter?
CHARLIE ADELSON: After I found out about the letter, I called Katie because I'm thinking, like, this has to be Sigfredo. Like, they're fighting, and he was behind what happened to me. Not that this has to be, but, like, it was really suspicious, and I wanted to see what her feelings were.
And she was avoiding me. You know, I tried to see Katie on Thursday. I tried to have her come to my office, either one of the offices I was working at. She wouldn't come. Tried to have her come on Friday. She wouldn't come. I wanted to see if she wanted to see me Saturday. She was avoiding me. And then -- it just all was lining up that it was making me question a lot.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, the government -- the State put in M. Is that a call that you had with Katie about meeting with her? And this is after the letter arrives.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I wanted her to come down to meet me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did she agree to meet with you on the evening of the 25th?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. She drove down to where I was at.
MR. RASHBAUM: Where did you meet with her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I met her at my parents’ building. I was downstairs.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you meet her around the same place that you had met with your mom after the bump?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did you do when you met? Did you stay in one spot, or did you go some place?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. We just went for a walk along the sidewalk along the water, and we walked probably a good 30, 40 minutes maybe.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did you discuss on your walk?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I confronted her and asked her, Do you think that this is Sigfredo that's doing this to my mom?
And she again said, No. Absolutely not.
I'm, like, But come on. Can you tell me? Because you guys are fighting, and I know he was behind now what happened to me. Is this what you guys are fighting about? Do you not want to tell me?
And she was adamant that it wasn't him.
And then I said, well, what about Tato? What about Luis Rivera?
And she said, It doesn't -- it doesn't seem like something he would do. This is not how he would do it. She said, But he -- you know, he's in- -- he is incarcerated, and Sigfredo did bring him on. He's the one who killed Dan. Is -- maybe one of his people is trying to do an extortion off of something that he thinks was a murder-for-hire, because whoever it is writing this thinks it was a murder-for-hire, which it wasn't.
So I opened up that possibility, and she said, Well, probably not. But she said, It could be -- it’s probably the police. She still was, like, it’s the police, but it could be a copycat.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did she tell you that she would do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She was gonna call the number, and I was, like, You haven't called yet?
And she's, like -- she said, no, she hadn't.
So I'm, like, Can you please call the number and see if you know these people and see if you can get it to stop.
MR. RASHBAUM: After you -- how long were you with her this evening on this walk where you're having this discussion?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I mean, it was probably 30 minutes there and 30 minutes back, and we sat for, like, ten minutes. So it was over an hour for sure. Hour and a half.
MR. RASHBAUM: When she left, did you stay in South Beach?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. And I -- and also I tried to get her to call the number by telling her, like, my parents are going to go to the police. Like, they are gonna go if you don't give them some peace of mind and find out that -- confirm for them.
MR. RASHBAUM: By the way, this is April 25th. Is that the last time that you saw Katherine Magbanua in person?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, after you meet with her that night, do you meet with your parents again?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I went over -- my parents were actually at my sister's apartment, which was a few blocks away. So when I got done there, I sat for a little while, and then I -- I went over to my parents" -- to my sister's apartment.
MR. RASHBAUM: When you went to your sister's apartment, was she there?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No, she wasn't.
MR. RASHBAUM: And who did you meet with?
CHARLIE ADELSON: My mom came downstairs. My dad -- the boys -- my dad stayed up in the apartment ‘cause the kids were sleeping.
MR. RASHBAUM: why did you meet with your mom alone outside of the apartment? what were you -- what was your mom and dad afraid of?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think what they didn't want was Wendi coming home and then question -- and starting to question what's going on.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did you tell your mom when you met with her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I told her that I talked to Katie, and she does not think that it's Sigfredo, and she still thinks it's the police, and that she's gonna look into it on the chance that it's a copycat and it's a second letter of extortion.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, April 26th, the government put in Exhibit 0, which is a call between Sigfredo Garcia and Katherine Magbanua, and they put in some text -- a text message which is P and Q, which are text messages between them.
Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: And I know you weren't privy to this in real time, but those calls and text messages show that the two of them are fighting still; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: And as a result of that -- strike that, Your Honor.
During those calls, what is Katherine Magbanua trying to get Sigfredo Garcia to do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She wants him to call the number.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, the next morning -- and this is R, 10:30 a.m., you have a call with your mom. Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. What date is that?
MR. RASHBAUM: April 26th now.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Okay.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you talk about whether she feels better about the things you told her last night. What were the things you told her last night?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I told her that it's the police and that you're not gonna be harmed. You're not gonna -- and you're not in any danger. And my mom was hung up on the fact that the person was ratcheting up the threats and making deliveries to their apartment, telling them that they're gonna be fucked if they don't pay up.
MR. RASHBAUM: And there's some discussion about the letter being written like a girl. Do you remember that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The beginning part of it was like a girl. The second part sounded real tough.
MR. RASHBAUM: And so what did you mean about the beginning part of it being written like a girl?
CHARLIE ADELSON: If this guy is saying that he's a Latin King, I can't imagine a Latin King writing “you don't care" as a phrase. It just -- it doesn't sound right. Doesn't mean it's not a copycat, but it doesn't sound like that's who it is -- who she thinks it js.
MR. RASHBAUM: At the end of this call -- and this is R again -- around two minutes in, you say: "One, they weren't the same person, without a doubt. Listen. I know. I actually do know how these things are done, and that was the same thing that I said. It is not done like this."
Your mom says, "Yeah. That is what you explained."
And you say, "No. It is 48 hours."
Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Exactly. Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: when you say they aren't the same person, what are you saying?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm saying it's not the same people that extorted me that are extorting you. It's clearly not the same as the first extortion,
MR. RASHBAUM: And when you say “it's 48 hours,” what are you referring to?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm referring to what happened to me on July 18th when I was told, You got 48 hours or we're gonna kill you.
MR. RASHBAUM: we then go to State's Exhibit $, which is later that same day, and you learn that your dad didn't go to work that day.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Why were you upset about that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I knew how this extortion was affecting them. I mean, my dad's probably missed two sick days in the last 20 years, and he's afraid he's gonna get killed in the parking lot and walking into his office because he's getting extorted by some Latin King gang member at this point, and he's afraid to go to work. So even though they're telling me they're okay, I know when my dad‘s not going to work there's something seriously wrong.
MR. RASHBAUM: And your mom asks you whether you ever checked the phone number I gave you last night. Again, what is she referring to?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She's saying did you follow up on this? Is this person really a dangerous person?
MR. RASHBAUM: Your mom then starts talking about fixing bridges and you say, "Mom, Mom, just stop with the fucking nonsense because I really don't want to come down there anymore."
What are you frustrated with her about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm frustrated -- my mom's trying to talk carefully, and I understand that. But I'm letting her know, like, this is the police. Like, I do not think you're in any danger. This is not the same as the extortion that I dealt with. They're not approaching you the same way I was approached. There are so many things that are different.
Like, I keep telling them, like, this is the police. You're not in any danger. And she's fixated and I understand. So they're older, and someone's sending a letter to the house saying you're gonna be fucked if you don't pay up. And they're scared.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you say 7 minutes and 18 seconds into the call, “It's not like, oh, we'll get one of them and the other one will stop -- start paying. That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard."
What are you referring to?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's -- that's what my mom's theory was -- is that they're gonna get her and they're gonna hurt her, and then someone else -- and then they'll go to someone else in the family, and then they'll start paying them.
MR. RASHBAUM: You then say, "First of all, they don't give you a number. I mean, everything is so traceable. They also weren't disguised."
Again you say ten seconds later, “This is not how it's done."
What are you reiterating over and over and over to your mom?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That these people aren't hiding who they are. For two years I was not given a name. I wasn't given phone numbers. These people have traceable devices. They're not -- they're not hiding. It's not done like this. This is different.
And then they kept saying, Well, what if you're wrong, and that's what kept me looking into it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Then we go to T. And by the way, T -- just to be clear, S$ was a call with your mom, and that call is at 4:00 o'clock p.m and lasts 15 minutes long. And then T is at 4:33 p.m. of the same day.
And this was the first call you had with Katie after you met with her; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Again, Katie is talking about a client and property; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, she is.
MR. RASHBAUM: And she asks you for a number. Did you have the number on you?
MR. RASHBAUM: How were you going to get the number?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I figured I'd just call my mom up and see if she had the number, and I'd get it to Katie.
MR. RASHBAUM: And on you, you try to get the number from your mom; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes. I called her.
MR. RASHBAUM: And did your mom have the number?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. She said that she had given it to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Everyone okay?
Technology.
JUDGE EVERETT: Technology.
Please continue.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay.
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's move on to W -- actually, we'll skip Ww.
Now, we go to the next day. The next day you have a call with -- this is -- this is X. You have a call with Katherine Magbanua at 10:42 in the morning, and to kind of spur your memory so that we don't have to play it again, this is the Drake call. Do you recall that call?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I recall it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. And during this call, there is some discussion about helping her out with a vacation. What was that about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She had asked me -- and it's on the wires before -- before the bump. She wanted to go down to the Keys, and there's a place that I would stay at that I have a connection to, and I could get a room really inexpensive. So she had reached out to me whether or not I could call up and get that connection for her, and I said, You know what, I'm gonna pay for it for you. So I -- I said, Wherever you go, I'm gonna take care of it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, can we briefly go sidebar again?
JUDGE EVERETT: Very briefly.
MR. RASHBAUM: Very briefly.
JUDGE EVERETT: Please approach.
(Sidebar conference was had on the stenographic record as follows:)
MR. RASHBAUM: So Call Y is in evidence I believe, but it was not played to the jury. So I would like to, I think, play it, but I want to make sure there's no -- I mean, it's in evidence.
JUDGE EVERETT: Ms. Cappleman?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: It's in evidence.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay.
JUDGE EVERETT: Play away.
MR. RASHBAUM: I just wanted to double-check.
(Sidebar conference was concluded.)
JUDGE EVERETT: Continue.
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, one of the calls that's in evidence but was not played yesterday is Y, and that's a call to your mom on the -- your mom calls you at 12:25 p.m. on the 27th. There's some discussion about Miami Heat tickets. Do you recall that call?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. Rather than play the whole call, let me just ask you some questions to see if you remember.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Sure.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall offering your parents Miami Heat tickets?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I --
MR. RASHBAUM: Playoffs?
CHARLIE ADELSON: -- I knew somebody who had -- who wanted to sell their tickets, so I wanted to see if they wanted to go.
MR. RASHBAUM: And they did not want to go; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. They didn't want to go.
MR. RASHBAUM: And why didn't they want to go?
CHARLIE ADELSON: They were -- they were still really upset about being extorted and the letter that came to the house on Monday, the day after my dad took a day off of work and didn't go to work.
MR. RASHBAUM: And, again, what do you repeatedly tell your parents on this call?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I -- I tell them that it’s not done like this, that this is -- basically I tell them it's not the same people and that you have nothing to worry about.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you talk to them about the location they live and the timing of when the bump occurred?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. This is that call.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what do you recall telling them about the location where they live and the timing of the bump?
CHARLIE ADELSON: What I was saying is that if -- they live in -- they live in a very small, safe area. For someone to do that in the middle of the day, it makes me think that it's even more the police because it would be so easy for them to get caught doing something. It's almost like these people don't care about getting caught.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. So let's briefly recap before we go on. The letter comes on the 25th; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: And no one makes any payment?
MR. RASHBAUM: The bump had happened on the 19th, and no one -- a week before, and no one made any payment; right?
MR. RASHBAUM: What's the next escalation point on April 28th? what happens next? What do the police do next?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The guy that came up to my mom on the street and wrote the letter to the house is now looking for her at work and calling her place of work and calling the office looking for her.
MR. RASHBAUM: So -- and this is, I believe, SX -- I'm sorry. State Exhibit 107. Okay.
Now, you're not on this call; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I think the guy called Erika.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what happens after this call?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Is this the one where the undercover calls Erika?
MR. RASHBAUM: Erika -- the undercover calls Erika.
And does someone call you after the undercover calls Erika?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. He said to Erika that, I gave Mrs. Adelson some important papers last week, and she knows what this is about. She needs to -- she needs to call me.
So then Erika called my mom and told her about this person that called the office. And my mom was scared because now they're tracking her down at work, and she called me up to -- actually she was really shaken.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, during this period of time, what had Katherine Magbanua been telling you about her calling the number?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She said she called the number and called another number and nobody picked up.
MR. RASHBAUM: So your mom calls you -- and that's Z. That's Z; correct? That's Z on April 28th at 9:42 a.m.
And why did you tell your mom during that call that it's odd that the guy called the office? What was odd about it?
CHARLIE ADELSON: It was odd that he called the office because Katie had been telling me she's been calling the number. So obviously the guy's not picking up but yet he's making phone calls.
MR. RASHBAUM: After that call, there are a series of calls where you try to reach Katherine Magbanua; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: why are you trying to reach her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I just heard that the guy's calling the office, and she said she'd called and the guy wasn't picking up, or she may have told me it was a nonworking number. And I was driving into the office at the time, and I had limited time to try to handle this before I got into the office and became really busy.
MR. RASHBAUM: Call AA they played -- the State played for the jury. That's a voice mail where you say, "Hey, it's me. It's important. Call me. Bye."
Do you remember that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, BB is on April 28th at 10:43 in the morning, and she calls you back; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, she called me back.
MR. RASHBAUM: What does Katie -- if you remember. And I can play it for you if you need it.
What does Katie first tell you about the phone number when you call her back -- when she calls you back?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She says it's a nonworking number and that it's a Gmail number, and it's -- and it's been called a hundred times.
MR. RASHBAUM: What do you understand her to be saying when she says it's a nonworking number?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That, like, when you call a number, it rings, and then you hear, like, a long beep and that no one's able to pick it up. It's not an active line.
MR. RASHBAUM: Later in this call, BB, she then tells you that she's been calling the number and it just rings. Do you remember that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: When she tells you that, how do you feel?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I know she's lying to me because it's either gonna be nonworking or it's ringing. It can't be both. And the guy's calling the office.
MR. RASHBAUM: And at that point in time, I think Ms. Cappleman termed it as things got stressful. You started to get upset with her; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I know she's lying to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: And as you're finding out that she's lying to you, what do you start to think?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I start to think that this could be Sigfredo and that that's -- that's why she's kind of covering and not wanting to come meet me when I keep asking her to come meet me. I think she found out that it's him and she's just BS-ing me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, at some point after the argument in the middle of the call, you soften and you say, "If someone's messing with you, they're messing with me."
why do you do that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: "Cause at that point -- at that point I wanted her to know that, like, I'm on your side. I'm not trying to set you up. I'm not -- I'm not turning anybody in. Like, I know you're innocent. I had nothing to do with this; I know you had nothing to do with this. But I need your help. And that's why I'm calling her is for help.
MR. RASHBAUM: At the end of the call, what does she tell you she'll do? What did she tell you to do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: At the end of the call, she says -- she says, You call that number.
I'm, like, fine. I'll call.
I mean, I don't know any of these people. I don't think anyone's gonna be afraid of me, but at this point, I don't care.
I said, You know what, let me just call the number. And I -- when I get to the office and I have a break, I'm gonna call him.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, does she tell you -- like she did with Sigfredo on a later call, does she tell you make sure you don't call from your cell phone?
MR. RASHBAUM: Does she tell you, like she did with Sigfredo on a later call, make sure you call froma landline?
MR. RASHBAUM: And you call from your cell phone; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I did, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, before you call from your cell phone, you do star 67. why did you do star 67?
CHARLIE ADELSON: In the event that it's the bad guy, I thought it would prevent him from having my cell phone number.
MR. RASHBAUM: By the way, in DD when you're going back and forth -- because there's some calls between you and her trying to get the number and seeing if the caller ID -- if there's caller ID at the dental practice. She says to you, “You want me to call from my fucking phone?"
And you say, "I can care less where you call from."
And she says, "Exactly."
why do you not care where either of you are calling from?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because if it's the police, it’s fine. I'm worried about if it's not the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: And why do you think that it doesn't matter where she calls from?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I don't think she's involved in the extortion of me or the murder of Dan Markel.
MR. RASHBAUM: At 1:51, a minute and 51 seconds into DD -- and, again, DD is that same -- the same morning, April 28th -- you say to her, "They can listen to whatever conversations they want."
You're talking about calling on your phone. Quote, "They can listen to whatever conversations they want."
Why do you not care about anyone hearing what you're talking about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because we weren't involved in a murder. You know, we're trying to figure out who's behind the second extortion and if my family is in any danger. If it's the police, let them listen in. That's fine.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, I want to play FF, and that's the call to the undercover.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
(Audio recording published in open court. This transcript should not be considered a verbatim record of these proceedings due to inaudibles and inability to distinguish between speakers. It should be noted that the best evidence of the actual content of the digital recording is the digital recording itself.)
(Audio begins:)
CHARLIE ADELSON: Hello?
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: Hola.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Hello. Who is this?
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: who is this?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Someone's been calling my family. I'm trying to figure out who this is.
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: In reference to what, Man?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Someone by the name of Sammy called.
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: Yeah, that's me, Man.
CHARLIE ADELSON: What's -- what's going on?
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: Well, what's going on is my brother Tato, okay? My brother Tato has not been taken care of. His family has not been taken care of. I talked to a dentist -- why are you calling me? Who are you? I gave the number to a lady.
CHARLIE ADELSON: I don't know Tato.
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: You don't know Tato?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I don't --
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: Do you know Katie and Tuto? They've been taken care of since the family problem's been taken care of up north.
CHARLIE ADELSON: I don't -- I don't know who you are?
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: You don't?
CHARLIE ADELSON: NO --
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: This isn't going away, my friend, because let me tell you something. I was at Broward with Tato, and he told me the whole story. He told me nobody has taken care of him. Nobody has taken care of his family.
The family was taking care of Katie and Tuto, and nothing's been taken care of with Tato. So you know. You know what's going on. And Tato needs to be taken care. Do the right thing.
The lady already has the paperwork. She knows what I'm talking about. We know Katie. we know Tuto. We know they've been taken care of.
CHARLIE ADELSON: All right. Let me -- let me look into things --
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: No more fucking around, Man. No more fucking around. This ain't going away. We need -- Tato needs -- you guys need to do the right thing for Tato. That's my brother, Man. That's my brother, and he needs to be taken care of. His family needs to be taken care of just like Katie and Tuto been taken care of.
CHARLIE ADELSON: I've never met -- met these people, but let me call you back. Okay?
OSCAR JIMENEZ JR.: That's bullshit, Man. You know exactly what I'm talking about. You know this lady. I don't know your relationship to the lady, but we know what the fuck is going on. It ain't going away. Take care of Tato just like you take care of Katie and Tuto, Man.
(Video playback concluded.)
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, in hours and hours of the wire, this is probably the quietest you've ever been. Why?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I was looking to get information from him. I wasn't looking to give him any information about me or anything. And he was pretty scary too when I was talking to him on the phone.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, when he starts speaking and he says things like "in reference to" and “do the right thing,” what did that make you believe?
CHARLIE ADELSON: He sounded educated. He didn't sound like a Latin King gang member.
MR. RASHBAUM: And after this call, going to GG, you have an 11-minute call with Katie; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I did, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you're not very good with names, are you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm horrible with names.
MR. RASHBAUM: So on that 11-minute call, not only do you, again, get the names Tuto and Tato confused, but now you start calling this undercover, whose name is Sammy, Simon; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. I changed his name by accident.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you do it on purpose to hide anything?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I'm just bad with names.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you say to Katie that you told him you don't even know who these people are and you don't know what he's talking about.
why is it important for you to tell Katie that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, because I don't want Katie to think that I'm trying to set her up or set her friends up, and I'm keeping quiet. And -- but at the same time, I'm going to her for help, and I'm letting her know, like, the guy picked up the phone call as soon as I called him.
MR. RASHBAUM: There's some conversation on this call about her working at the office. Did Katie ever work at your office?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No, never.
MR. RASHBAUM: So when she brings up on this call working at your office, why do you kind of just say, Yeah. You're a great worker at the office or whatever you say?
Why do you not say, Katie, I don't know what you're talking about. You've never worked at the office?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. If I would have talk bluntly and said you don't work at the office -- is what the checks were for -- and that she was cashing them, she would have -- she would known I was setting her up, setting her friends up.
MR. RASHBAUM: You say things on the call like, I might have the wrong Katie. It might be another Katie.
why do you tell her that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because she got -- when I called her back, she got, like, really quiet, like, almost like she sounded like she wasn't trusting me and almost like she was suspecting me of trying to set her and her friends up. And that's why I really pushed to say, like, hey, I -- you know, I'm not setting you up and talk to her like that.
MR. RASHBAUM: What was all that you cared about at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I just wanted the extortion to stop.
MR. RASHBAUM: And when you say you just wanted the extortion to stop, who were you worried about? what were you worried about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: well, I was -- I was worried that -- you know, my parents -- my parents were really upset. I was worried that my parents were gonna go to the police and catch the second extortion, and then -- or go to the police and end up having to tell them about what happened to me in the first place, and then I was gonna have to worry about the original extortion coming after me. And at this point, I know that it involves the head of the Latin Kings and Sigfredo Garcia. That's -- I wasn't gonna talk to the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: You talked to her about the guy coming up with details. What details did he come up with on this call?
CHARLIE ADELSON: He knew -- he knew about payment.
MR. RASHBAUM: You specifically tell her that he mentioned her name or a Katie. why do you tell her that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I'm letting her know this involves you. Like, I need your help, but, you know, this guy has details that are -- that are wrong, but he has details.
MR. RASHBAUM: And on this call and some others, what do you tell her about your parents?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I tell her that my parents are close to going to the police to try to get her to help me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, does Katie have any idea at this point in time, any idea whatsoever, that your mom had known for 21 months about the original extortion?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I've been -- that's what I've been lying to Katie about and telling her that my parents have no idea what happened to me and I just tell them it's a long story and I can't talk about it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. Exhibit II is already in evidence. On that call it's a call between Katie and Sigfredo. Katie is trying -- is filling Sigfredo in; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: And on that call, a minute and 47 seconds into the call, she says to Sigfredo, "And, like, they're very, very close to reporting it already.”
What is she talking about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She's letting him know what I've been telling her is that my parents are gonna go to the police if you can't get these friends of yours to either stop or -- and contact them.
MR. RASHBAUM: I want to take a couple seconds and dissect this statement.
You understand that the State's theory is that Katie, Sigfredo, and Luis Rivera conspired, not only with you, but also with your sister and your parents, to kill Professor Markel. You understand that; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's their theory.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you understand that here Katie is telling Sigfredo, I'm worried that they're going to go to the police.
She's not telling it to you. She's telling it to Sigfredo Garcia. Is that what's happening here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: That's exactly what's happening.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, the State -- you've heard it in this trial -- says Katie tried to silo people; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: CNodding the head)
MR. RASHBAUM: Nonetheless, Katie is telling Sigfredo that the very people that, according to the State, are co-conspirators for, are gonna go to the police and report what? Does it make any sense?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No, not at all.
MR. RASHBAUM: About in -- I'm gonna go to JJ now, and that's the same day at 1:46. About 15 minutes later, Sigfredo Garcia calls Katie back.
And during this call, he says he's gonna get rid of his phone, and Katie tells him not to call from his phone or from the office ‘cause he says -- what does he say he's gonna do?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think he's gonna call the -- call the person who's extorting my family.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, before this point in time, Katie has told you that he and she -- or at least she has called the number how many times?
CHARLIE ADELSON: She says it's been called a hundred times. She said it's not working. It's a Gmail number.
MR. RASHBAUM: Moving to later in the day, LL, this is a call between you and Katie. That call begins with her again saying that she called the number.
Did you find out later through discovery that she never called the number?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. Many years later I found out.
MR. RASHBAUM: She then says that Sigfredo Garcia left a message. Did you find out in discovery that no message was ever left?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah. They were lying. I found out years later.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, during this call -- by the way, did you know they were lying at the time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: No. I thought she was telling me the truth.
MR. RASHBAUM: During this call, you say, "I don't want anyone to go to jail. Because you know what? People get mad when they go to jail, and they feel like they have somebody to get back at."
Do you recall saying that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Why did you tell her that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I wanted to let her know that I'm not going to the police and I'm not turning anybody in.
MR. RASHBAUM: On a later call, do you recall saying what you thought the police could do to protect you?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I think I thought the police couldn't protect me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall saying to Katie, "I'll give you a secret" --
MS. CAPPLEMAN: May I inquire what call we're referencing?
MR. RASHBAUM: I'll move on Your Honor. we'll do it tomorrow.
JUDGE EVERETT: You got a few more minutes. You might as well make use of it while you've got it.
MR. RASHBAUM: TI got other stuff to do today.
JUDGE EVERETT: Go ahead.
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: There's discussions on some of these calls about meeting Katie. Did you ever meet her?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The last time I saw her was that Monday, April 25th.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now we get to OO, and that's the same day in the evening, and it's a call with your mom. And to refresh your memory on the call so that I don't have to play the whole thing, the call starts with you saying, "I'd rather not talk on the phone,” and then you talk on the phone for 41 minutes.
Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: You say to your mom not to worry, that you're 99 percent sure of it. What are you sure of?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm sure it's the police.
MR. RASHBAUM: why are you so sure of it at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Because I had spoken to the undercover, and when I spoke to him, I realized this is obviously not Sigfredo Garcia. And the way the guy spoke on the phone and, again, how different he was than how a real Latin King would be, he's not who he says he is. And at that point, I really -- I feel very strongly it's the police at that point.
MR. RASHBAUM: And, again, you describe why you don't think it’s a real extortion; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: For the same reasons that we've gone over -- over and over today; correct?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Your mom says that they're barking up the wrong tree. Why -- what did you understand her to mean when she said they're barking up the wrong tree?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Well, they think it's a murder-for-hire. They don't realize that it was an extortion on our end.
MR. RASHBAUM: And your mom says 24 minutes and 20 seconds into the call, "I just hope they don't go and bother Wendi.”
And you respond that "Wendi was scared from day one. She is just getting over this."
What is wendi just getting over?
CHARLIE ADELSON: The murder of her ex-husband.
MR. RASHBAUM: But according to the State, Wendi Adelson is a co-conspirator with you in her ex-husband's murder.
CHARLIE ADELSON: The State's wrong. Wrong about a lot of things.
MR. RASHBAUM: And, in fact, you then go on to explain again that Wendi is just getting over the tragedy. This is the second time that you have described Professor Markel's murder as a tragedy -- right? -- on the wires?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: The first time was nearly a week before the bump.
CHARLIE ADELSON: It was.
MR. RASHBAUM: 33 minutes and 40 seconds into the call -- and this was not played for the jury yesterday -- you say, "They got theories out there. Someone thinks that our family paid for this to be done."
What are you saying here?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm saying it's the police, and their theory is they think it was a murder-for-hire, and that's why they're investigating it the way they're doing it and they're pretending to be gang members who are coming back for more money.
MR. RASHBAUM: Going back to Dolce Vita.
CHARLIE ADELSON: Mm-hmm.
MR. RASHBAUM: You're aware Dolce Vita is, according to the State, the final straw that led to your arrest; right?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: Going back to Dolce Vita, did you say something very similar to this in Dolce Vita?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: What did you say in Dolce Vita?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I said they only know part of the story or they think they know part of the story. And --
MR. RASHBAUM: What do they think?
CHARLIE ADELSON: They think it was a murder-for-hire, and that --
MR. RASHBAUM: What was it?
CHARLIE ADELSON: It was an extortion.
MR. RASHBAUM: Going to the next day, PP, which is in evidence but was not published to the jury, I want to play a portion of it.
(Audio recording published in open court. This transcript should not be considered a verbatim record of these proceedings due to inaudibles and inability to distinguish between speakers. It should be noted that the best evidence of the actual content of the digital recording is the digital recording itself.)
(Audio begins:)
CHARLIE ADELSON: It's somebody, not from the first layer, but probably the second layer.
(Audio playback concluded.)
BY MR. RASHBAUM:
MR. RASHBAUM: You say, "It's somebody, not from the first layer, but probably the second layer."
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: What are you saying there?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I'm saying I think it's a copycat extorter off of the first extorter. So the second is copying the first.
MR. RASHBAUM: And who did you think that copycat was?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I thought the copycat could have been somebody from Luis Rivera, somebody that he may have known or known what he did, and now they're trying to -- they're trying to do an extortion of their own, be a copycat.
MR. RASHBAUM: And if it isn't a copycat, who still did you think it was most likely at this point in time?
CHARLIE ADELSON: I thought it was most likely the police if it wasn't a copycat.
MR. RASHBAUM: By the way, 22 minutes into that call, PP, there's reference to a jet ski incident. Do you recall that?
CHARLIE ADELSON: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: What jet ski incident are you talking about?
CHARLIE ADELSON: When -- when I went to pick Katie up to go jet skiing July 1st and Sigfredo cut in front of me and slammed on his brakes and got out of the car and started threatening me and then started leaving threatening messages on my dad's phone that night.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, I'm about to move on to the next day. Would you like me to do that?
JUDGE EVERETT: If you can stop it within five minutes, your next line of questioning.
MR. RASHBAUM: I think it goes a little longer than that.
JUDGE EVERETT: Very well.
Members of the jury, we're going to take our break for the evening at this point. Once again, you're going to receive the same instruction. Do not discuss the case with each other or anyone else. Do not look at any news coverage. Do not seek any information about the case.
we'll resume tomorrow at 8:45. Please report by 8:30 and have a good evening.
(The jury exited the courtroom.)
JUDGE EVERETT: You may be step down, Mr. Adelson.
Everyone can be seated.
Briefly go over the schedule for tomorrow. From here, how much more examination do you believe you have, Mr. Rashbaum?
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, I'm getting pretty far. I would say I think I have maybe an hour left.
JUDGE EVERETT: Very well.
Ms. Cappleman, after your cross-examination, does the State have any rebuttal witnesses that you intend to put on?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I think not, Your Honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: Very well.
will the Defense have any additional witnesses after Mr. Adelson?
MR. RASHBAUM: Most likely not. We will have a redirect.
JUDGE EVERETT: You will. How much time you spend with it, that's up to you.
If the State is not going to put on any rebuttal, then at that point, we'll probably be able to go into the charge conference. I've been editing the instructions as I've sent at least the initial draft to you-all. I would expect it would go fairly quickly, but we'll see.
Yes, sir?
MR. RASHBAUM: May we briefly go sidebar and discuss one brief issue?
JUDGE EVERETT: You can.
(Sidebar conference was had on the stenographic record as follows:)
JUDGE EVERETT: Go ahead.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, we received last night discovery from the State regarding Mr. Adelson reaching out to the police regarding two incidents since -- I don't remember the dates.
we had no problem with the State asking questions regarding the incidents and him reaching out to the police. The issue is one of the incidents has to do with his -- the mother of his child, and it's a domestic incident where Mr. Adelson reached out to the police against her. We're just asking that that not be inquired into.
So we're okay with the first incident, which is a photographer and him calling the police, and we're okay with a general question regarding other times he's called the police.
JUDGE EVERETT: But the specifics of the domestic episode?
MR. RASHBAUM: We would ask that it be stricken under a 403 analysis.
JUDGE EVERETT: MS. Cappleman?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I don't have any intention of getting into specifics unless he's denying things.
JUDGE EVERETT: I assume he won't, but --
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I agree.
JUDGE EVERETT: -- you never know until the question is answered.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: We can approach if I think that's becomes appropriate.
JUDGE EVERETT: Very well.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, the only other issue -- not issue, but a request is I think -- I'm gonna do my best to go quickly tomorrow morning. I assume Ms. Cappleman will have a pretty lengthy cross of some sort, and then I want to redirect that. I hope to be short depending on what she does.
And then on the charging conference, I would request that we close on Monday. And the reason why I'm asking for that is there's a lot in this trial. We're ahead of schedule. And I would like the ability to discuss the closing with my client, which I will not have the opportunity to do if we were to close tomorrow.
JUDGE EVERETT: Okay. AS in the argument you intend to make, you want his thoughts or just his feedback on it?
MR. RASHBAUM: I'd like to have his feedback on it for a case like this where he's facing the rest of his life in prison.
JUDGE EVERETT: Ms. Cappleman?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I have separate concerns about giving the jury this case --
JUDGE EVERETT: On a Friday evening?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: -- on a Friday afternoon, yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: I agree with her.
JUDGE EVERETT: AS in they're ready to run away from all of us --
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Yeah. So, like, sequestration, I just -- I would prefer to do it Monday as well, and I'd like to -- it would be great to know that now as opposed to waiting and seeing.
JUDGE EVERETT: I don't have a problem with doing that. I guess really, since I instruct first and the closings occurs second, you probably don't even want me to instruct them until the closing would begin.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Probably not --
MR. RASHBAUM: Probably not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: -- ‘cause we want it to be fresh in their mind as they consider --
JUDGE EVERETT: So essentially we'll just have a half a day tomorrow. That's what you-all are asking for?
MR. RASHBAUM: Yes, Your Honor
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Three-quarter day.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, maybe --
JUDGE EVERETT: Three quarter --
MR. RASHBAUM: Maybe I'll go longer.
JUDGE EVERETT: I mean ...
MS. MEYERS: I won't allow that, Judge.
JUDGE EVERETT: Your audience of 12, you-all need to advocate in the manner in which you believe will be most effective for them, but I don't have a problem with ending early tomorrow.
MR. RASHBAUM: Thank you, Your Honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: All right.
(Sidebar conference was concluded.)
JUDGE EVERETT: All right. We are in recess. Please report by 8:30 tomorrow. Have a good evening, everyone.
(Court adjourned at 5:45 p.m., and the proceedings were continued to 11/3/23 at 8:30 a.m.)