Katherine Magbanua — Direct/Cross/Redirect
1,377 linesJUDGE EVERETT: Yes, you may.
JUDGE EVERETT: You can be seated for now.
JUDGE EVERETT: If the jurors are good to be brought in, please bring them in.
JUDGE EVERETT: Come in. You'll need to remain standing. I will swear you in, and then you can take your seat.
JUDGE EVERETT: Okay? The witness may be seated.
JUDGE EVERETT: Please raise your right hand.
JUDGE EVERETT: Do you swear or affirm the testimony you're about to give will be the truth?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I do.
JUDGE EVERETT: You may take your seat.
JUDGE EVERETT: Please speak loudly and clearly.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, your honor.
JUDGE EVERETT: Say your name and spell your name.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Katherine Magbanua. K-A-T-H-E-R-I-N-E, M-A-G-B-A-N-U-A.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I see that you're in jail clothes. Are you currently in custody?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What are you in custody for?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: The murder.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Are you doing a sentence for murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: You were convicted of murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And is that the murder of Dan Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you have a trial in your case?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you testify?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: You testified on your own behalf?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And when you testified, were you truthful with the jury?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I was not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you take the same oath that you just took today in your own trial?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What was your defense when you were tried?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That I had nothing to do with it.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. That we got it right in reference to Charlie Adelson and we got it right in reference to the killers, but you weren't in the middle.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Was that true?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, it was not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Were you in the middle?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And didn't you also testify in the trial in which Sigfredo Garcia was convicted of murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And what was his defense?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That he had nothing to do with it.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: That we got it right in reference to Charlie Adelson and we got it right in reference to the killers, but he had nothing to do with it, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And — Was that defense truthful?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No ma'am, it was not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So Sigfredo Garcia was involved?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma'am, he was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So why tell the truth now?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe that the truth needed to come out now so that the family can get some type of closure.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Why didn't the truth need to come out last year or the year before or the year before that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I was trying to defend myself.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: You were trying to get off?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you think you'd be successful in your trial with that defense?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I thought so.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Has anyone promised you anything for your testimony here today?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Weren't you originally offered immunity for cooperation in this case?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma'am, I was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: But you didn't take us up on that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No ma'am, I didn't.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Because you thought you could get off completely?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And now you're doing a life sentence?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma'am, I am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did Charlie Adelson threaten to harm you if you told the truth?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No ma'am, he didn't threaten me.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did anybody threaten you to keep your silence?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did anybody promise you anything if you remain silent all these years?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I wasn't promised anything, but I mean the I wasn't promised anything.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Go ahead, finish your thought. You didn't you weren't promised anything but what?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I I thought everything was going to be okay.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: You thought you'd be acquitted?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, so did you know Dan Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you have any personal beef with him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What was your motivation for becoming a part of this murder plot?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Financially.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So not as a favor to Charlie Adelson?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I'll rephrase it, Your Honor. Was it a favor to Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, it was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, but your primary motivation was not a favor to Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Well, yes, ma'am, it was, and financially.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, because you were going to get paid for your part?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: How much did you get paid?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't know the exact amount.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What was your relationship to Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He was my ex-boyfriend.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: When did you meet him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe that was in 2013.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Do you know what month?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Has to be around September.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Can you point him out and describe what he's wearing?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He's sitting over there with a blue jacket and a blue tie.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Let the record reflect the witness has identified the defendant. Showing you what is marked as State's 48—this—exhibit.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma'am, I do.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: How do you recognize it?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Um, that's when we went to Key West.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Is that a fair and accurate photo of you and Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, it is.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Is that when the two of you were when the two of you were dating?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Judge, at this time, I ask to move into evidence State's 48.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Do we have that for publication?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So, was this photo taken before or after the murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Before.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Who came up with the idea to kill Dan Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Charlie.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So, Sigfredo Garcia didn't come up with the idea?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, he did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Louis Rivera didn't come up with the idea?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, he did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: When did the defendant first bring this idea up to you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: My first recollection was around Halloween of 2013.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Around Halloween or on the actual day?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: On Halloween, yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. What's your recollection of how that came up?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: We were at a Halloween party in Lincoln Road, and right before we were about to go, he got in the car with me and he asked me a question.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What was the question?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Do you know anybody that can harm someone?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And did you know anybody that could harm someone?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma'am, I did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Who was that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Sigfredo.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And at the time, what was your relationship with Sigfredo?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Wasn't the best.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: But he was the father of your children, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So were you dating both men at this time, or were you only dating—
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I was only dating Charlie.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And so he initially he meaning the defendant — initially said, "Do you know anyone that could harm someone?" Was he aware of your connection to Sigfredo Garcia when he made that statement?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not that I know of, no ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you suggest Sigfredo Garcia at that time to the defendant?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What did you say?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I just said yes and kind of left it alone.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. Did it go any further than that at that time?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not at that not that night.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you know who he wanted harmed at that time?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. Had you become aware during the course of your relationship with him that he had some kind of issue going on with his sister's ex-husband?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What did you learn about that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He was just stating that his family wasn't his mom and dad was stressed and that his sister was having problems with her husband and custody of her two children.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And when did you learn that the person that the defendant wanted harmed was this ex-husband of the sister?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe later on.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And did you when did you learn the name Dan Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: It wasn't until I don't know if it was on my trial or when Sigfredo got arrested.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, so even when he was killed, you didn't know the name of the person that was being killed?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I never knew his name.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: How did the defendant refer to this person, if not by the name Dan or Danny Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Wendi's husband.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So you knew that the person that was going to be initially harmed was Wendi's husband?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, and you knew that there were issues, or what did you know about the beef with him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That I mean, he was just he painted this picture that this was a terrible man and making his family go through a lot custody-wise with his sister.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Right. And was, when he would say these things to you, is it in the context of his mom specifically or his family in general?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe it was more towards his mom.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Meaning what?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That his mom hasn't been sleeping, his mom's not eating. I know his dad wasn't in the best health either, but it was he would refer to his mom a lot.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And the reason she wasn't sleeping or eating, did that have to do with this ex-husband of Wendi?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes ma am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you ever tell the defendant who it was that was going to be doing the job?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Why didn't you say the name Sigfredo to Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I always referred to each other as "my friend." Either — neither one of them wanted to really hear each other's names.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And why is that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Because Sigfredo was the—my—the father of my kids and I was dating him at that time. I was dating Charlie at that time.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, so Sigfredo Garcia, did he have strong feelings about the defendant?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, he didn't like him.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And is that because you were dating him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, and vice versa, you're not going to talk about the child's father with the new boyfriend either?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So is it true then that you were sort of walling these two off from each other before the issue of the murder and the conspiracy ever even arose?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And did that pattern continue throughout the murder conspiracy?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, it did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Do you think Charlie Adelson knew that it was your child's father that you were going to?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He might have had an idea, but he just never said it out loud.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: There's one phone call between, I think it's from Sigfredo Garcia to Harvey Adelson, the father of the defendant. In it, do you know anything about that phone call that was on July 1st of 2014?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What do you know about that phone call?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: From the trial, what I remember was that Sigfredo had contacted, or was trying to contact, Charlie, but we were in a heated argument at that time. We were kind of in the middle of the street, and I guess it's the first thing he looked up was his work number.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, so you say you're in a heated argument. Is this the confrontation that occurred where you and the defendant were going jet skiing?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe that was after.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: It was after that incident?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. How many interactions, personally, face-to-face, did, to your knowledge, Charlie Adelson have with Sigfredo Garcia?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That was probably the only one that I remember was that jet ski accident.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Accident? Or, like, the confrontation. All right, tell us what happened at that confrontation.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Sigfredo had just picked up the kids, and he was eating at a corner pizza place with the kids, and he saw that Charlie was coming by to go pick me up and, I guess, saw the jet skis in the back of the car. So he loaded up the kids and cut us off, was screaming a couple things out loud, but we didn't really hear anything because our windows was up.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. Did you say he cut you off — as, do you mean in traffic?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: In the back, in the back street of where I lived at, at that time.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And when you say he cut you off, did he run you off the road or something else?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He kind of just went right and blocked the road in front of us, so Charlie had to kind of do a three-point turn and go around the other way.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did the two men actually get out into the street and confront each other?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, they did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. Were any actual words exchanged through the windows — through the windows?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, but I had my window up, so we didn't know what Sigfredo was saying.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. So Sigfredo shouted some things out the window. Did Mr. Adelson do the same?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, he did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And what were the things that were shouted out the window — were you able to hear them or not?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I didn't hear anything. And —
MS. CAPPLEMAN: At this point, this is July 1st of 2014, the plot is already underway to do this murder, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Does Sigfredo Garcia know that he's doing the murder for Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: To my knowledge, he might have had an inkling about it, but I don't know — that was never spoken of.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. The killers — and when I say "the killers" I'm referring to Garcia and Rivera — knew they were doing something for a lady to get her kids back. Do you know how they knew that information?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe it's because of the envelope that Charlie gave me.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So you didn't relay that information to them, that it had to do with a lady and her kids?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I might have mentioned it to Sigfredo, yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. So if you mentioned that to Sigfredo, would you be — I guess, were you intentionally trying to characterize this job as being related to someone other than Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so, yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Because — is that because Sigfredo Garcia would not have wanted to do anything to help out Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am. So —
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Do you think Sigfredo knew that this lady with the kids was somehow connected to Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And there was going to be a lot of money paid for this job, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you know anybody else with that kind of money, or that might have had that kind of money to get this job for them?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, you mentioned the paper.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Luis Rivera said there was a paper that Sigfredo had when they came to do the murder. Do you know anything about that paper?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I don't.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. Did you provide a paper to Sigfredo Garcia?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And when you say you don't know anything about it, but you gave it to him, you obviously know something about it, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. So tell us what — I know what you're trying to say is, you don't know what was on the paper.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: The content of it, yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Tell us how you got the paper.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Tell us how you came into possession of this paper that the killers had.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Okay. One day, just a random night that I was over at Charlie's house, he had a manila envelope that was sealed.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He told me, "Katie, do not open it.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Do not touch it. Do not look inside it.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I didn't print this paper out from my office.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I printed it probably from another office, and basically, really, you know, give that paper to the other person," who is — saying this —
MS. CAPPLEMAN: This was Charlie, this defendant?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So he says to you, "I have this paper." How does he give it to you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I had a diaper bag, so he showed me the envelope and I was like, just put it in there.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did he express any concerns about fingerprints being on the envelope or the contents?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am. He said he wore a glove so that there's no fingerprints on it. He was very specific about me not opening it and not looking inside it. And he also told me that he didn't print it from his office.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And what about licking the envelope?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: And that he didn't lick the envelope.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: He said he did not lick the envelope?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He did not lick the envelope.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And what was the purpose of that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I guess his DNA.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. So did you touch the envelope?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: It was in my diaper bag, but I don't remember if I ever — I never opened it, but I might have touched it just to put — stick it inside in my diaper bag.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And did you deliver the envelope to Sigfredo Garcia?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I call — I contact — I must have contacted Sigfredo and just told them, hey, come by the house. And then, you know, he was kind of in and out of my life, so he pop up. He literally got the envelope. I was like, "You have something inside that bag," and then he grabbed it, stuffed in his pants, and left.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: In regards to the June trip that the killers made, did you provide Garcia or Rivera with any money for expenses associated with that trip?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And where did you get the money from to do that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: From Charlie Adelson.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Can you tell us about that? What was — what was the context of you getting that money?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Sigfredo would just ask me, hey, um, I'm gonna need some money, I need to go out of town, and I'm like, okay. So then I'd go to Charlie, or I'd be at Charlie's house, and I'll tell him I need some money for the expenses.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And he gave you some money?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: About how much money, if you know?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I can't recall, but it was a couple hundred dollars. So —
MS. CAPPLEMAN: This thing started back in October of '13 and doesn't get done until July of '14. Is there — can you describe whether there's any pressure as time is going on and this thing is not getting done?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I'm trying to remember. Like, in the beginning of the year, I don't think there was really much. I mean, he was — he's been planting this seed in my head that this needed to get done, this — they need to get done. And I guess towards probably around June, July is when he was a little bit more adamant about this job getting done.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. And when you say "he," you're talking about who?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Charlie.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you ever have any contact with any other Adelson about this job?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, no, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: In — the context of "this needs to get done," this pressure getting put on you — is there ever a mention of the mom, Donna, or the divorce situation in the context of getting it done at that time?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not that I could recall.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: We — published 35, please. Is — this you on the left side of the screen?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, it is.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And was this picture — where was this picture taken?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: This was in South Beach. I believe the building that they were living at — at the — where Charlie's parents were living at.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Is that the Icon?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't — I don't think that was an Icon. It was somewhere in First and Ocean.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, so different residences?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And this photo — was this the first time you'd ever met Wendi, or had you already known Wendi before this photo?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I met her one time prior to this, because I believe this was in Father's Day. So I met her around spring break, when I had dinner with her and Jeffrey.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, so the Yardbird restaurant?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, so this was the second time you'd met her?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you have a relationship with her outside of her being Charlie's sister?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you communicate with her by phone or through any apps or anything like that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you receive any communication from her specifically about the homicide?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did Wendi ever give you any money or other gifts?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, she did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did anybody pay you for your part in the murder other than Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, they did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And the payments from Charlie Adelson — did those include the checks that were signed by his mother from the Adelson Institute?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, it was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you perform any job at the Adelson Institute?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: You didn't go up there and clean on the weekends?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: On the night of the murder, did you go to the defendant's house?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And where was that house, or what house was that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That was in Whale Harbor in Fort Lauderdale.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. And did you get payment for the murder that night?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe it was the following morning, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Were you in a panic when you arrived at his house?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Was I in a panic?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: In a panic.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I wasn't in a panic, but Charlie was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, explain that. How was he acting?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: When I opened the door, he had — he was kind of frantic, and he had a gun in his hand, and he was just all over the place.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Was that normal behavior for him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not having a gun in his hand, no, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. Did you know him to have a gun prior to that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am. He has a gun safe.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. But he just didn't usually carry around in his hand?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yeah, he's never had it in his hand.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What was — he saying to you when he was in this frantic state?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I can't really recall, because he had given me some Xanax, so it was a little blurry that night, and I — I just tend to — I just fell asleep. I think we both fell asleep, so —
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. Can you tell the jury whether the excitement that he was showing had to do with the murder or something else?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, it had to do with that.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. Was anybody else there at his residence when you arrived at that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you ever see his parents at the residence?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I didn't see his parents.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: How was the money packaged when you got — I think you said you got it the next morning?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am. It was — it was in — it was in a plastic — the money was in a plastic bag, like a Ziploc bag, that was inside a brown bag, and then like a grocery bag over it.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And was the money stapled?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, it was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Can you explain how it was stapled? Like, what size bills, and what increments were stapled together?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe it was stapled in — I never counted it — but it was like in a stack, and it was stapled in the corner.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. Were they $100 bills, or something else?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: They were $100 bills, and there was some 20s and 50s.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And was the money damp?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, it was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Explain what — what you mean to the jury.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Um, a couple days after that, um, I went and I opened the bag, and I called Sigfredo and I told him, I was like, "There's mold on this money," and he's like, "Well, blow dry it," and I was like, "But why would there be mold on the money?" and he's just, "I don't know, just blow dry it." So, um, I believe his parents — parents — or his mom might have washed the money.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: You mean, like, physically washed the money?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And why do you think his mom did it?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Because he was always adamant about telling me he didn't have any money in his house.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: And he told me that his parents had just stopped by right before I got there.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: So all of a sudden he had money to put in the trunk of my car the following day.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Was the money already sorted out and packaged when you first saw it, or was he doing that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, it was already stacked and sorted out.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. And did he have to — so he didn't have to go anywhere to get the money. He already had it when you arrived.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Was there any argument that night about the money, or the next morning?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: With me and Charlie?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you — I guess you did stay there that night? You may have already said that.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I fell asleep.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Was there any argument with the defendant at all about anything that night?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am. Not that I can recall.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you threaten him in any way?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Judge, can we get a second?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I'm — going to continue with your examination.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you, the night that you went to get the money, did you threaten Charlie Adelson in any way?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you try to extort money out of him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: The money that he gave you — is that something that had already been discussed or agreed upon in reference to this homicide?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Well, I believe — yes, because it was — it was gonna be payment for this.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: You weren't — well, were you sent with a message from Sigfredo to tell him he better give it up or else?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you relay to the defendant that his family was in danger if he didn't give you whatever it was you were asking for?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: How did Sigfredo Garcia and Luis Rivera get paid for their part in this murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That morning when I woke up I was like, like, oh my god, I gotta go. So I drove back down and I was trying to look for Sigfredo, and having a hard time that morning, and then eventually I made it to the alleyway of where Luis's building was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Was that on North Miami?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And like 135th, where he lived with Jessica?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, go ahead.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: And he just — I was just waiting in the car, and all of a sudden Sigfredo just like popped up and got inside the passenger seat.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, so they got their money from you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Sigfredo, then. And Rivera got paid as well, didn't he?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so, yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right. I want to draw your attention to what we're calling "the bump." You know what we're talking about?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: After the bump and the subsequent conversations were occurring, did you have any contact with any other Adelson about the bump other than Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So you didn't talk to Wendi about it?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Didn't talk to Harvey or Donna about it?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: On the Dolce Vita meeting, do you recall what meeting I'm referencing?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, was that a restaurant that you met Charlie at after the bump?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, in that meeting — and the jury hasn't heard this yet — but he's saying one of two scenarios. This is one of two scenarios.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Do you remember that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I do.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What were the one of two scenarios? What were the two scenarios?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: What he was speaking of was probably the FBI or Tato blackmailing.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And by Tato you mean Rivera?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Louis Rivera, yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Were you concerned about that as well?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And what did you do to try to figure out who it was that had approached Donna Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I asked Sigfredo, so he was supposed to be looking into it.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Yes, ma'am. Were you there whenever he did whatever he did to try to find out who it was? Where— were you present when Sigfredo, I guess, went out and talked to people about whether—
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I was not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Because at that time, was Rivera in custody?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, he was. Yeah, he was already doing his federal sentence, I believe.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: So, was the concern that maybe some of his associates might have done this?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Maybe he had run his mouth about it?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Have you reviewed what I had marked for State's Exhibit 111, the Dolce Vita recording with the transcript attached?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And does the transcript in that exhibit accurately reflect the words that were said at that meeting between yourself and the defendant?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: When the defendant described the bump to you— strike.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: When you were speaking with Charlie Adelson and also Sigfredo Garcia about this bump, did you speak in code?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And what was the purpose of speaking in code?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: To just piggyback with what Charlie was speaking to me in code, so I kind of was like, okay, if he's talking in codes, kind of speak in codes as well.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Was the concern that the calls could be recorded, being recorded?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: My concern was more that I was at work, so I really didn't want to say any phone numbers out loud or speak of what was going on.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I'm going to approach and show you what I've marked as State's demonstrative aid.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Have you seen this before?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I have not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, and it's got several items listed here as code words with the actual meaning next to them.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Would you take a moment to just— and the ones in red are the ones used by you, the ones in yellow are used by Charlie Adelson.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Okay.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Will you review this exhibit and just tell me if it's accurate?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma—'am, it's— it's accurate.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Judge, at this time, I'd ask to make use of State's Demonstrative A.
JUDGE EVERETT: Any objections?
MR. RASHBAUM: May I see it?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I can borrow a Sharpie from the clerk.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: May I publish?
JUDGE EVERETT: You may.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, so the first one we have is $65.70, and again the jury hasn't heard these calls yet, but when you were talking to Sigfredo Garcia about $65.70, were you referring to the undercover phone number?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: To Charlie about an agent.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Were you talking about— it seems like you're talking about a real estate agent, but are you talking about the undercover agent that approached his mother?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, I was.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And the CD, was that reference to a recording that the Adelsons made of their contact with the undercover?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: A recording of their contact with them?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Yes.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That they were being recorded?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: No, that they called undercover and recorded it.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you ever actually hear that recording?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, not until my trial.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And then there's a lot of discussion about this client or this tenant. You need to find out if this is going to be a good tenant or a bad tenant.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Was the tenant this person, if it really was a blackmailer, this thug that's somehow affiliated with Rivera?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: The false lead or the phishing — what did that mean? There's a lot of discussion about, "I hope it's just somebody phishing."
MS. CAPPLEMAN: —from the phone calls?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, this is all from the phone call.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Yes, ma'am. It was one of the two scenarios — that it could be law enforcement?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: But this was Charlie basically saying this the whole time. He's the one who's coming up with all the scenarios?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Okay.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: But when he's talking about the scenarios, he's talking about phishing?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: He doesn't say law enforcement?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am. He says it could be, you know, a tenant or something like that.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Anything but what?
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, I'm just going to— check, leading.
JUDGE EVERETT: Please rephrase your question. The objection is sustained.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: About the listing or the properties — what did that refer to?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: About the paperwork. That's pretty accurate. Looking into a listing. Yes, the listing. Because I worked in a real estate agency at that time. So he was just telling me, look into the listing, saying, "Oh, this will be a good investment." So it was really Charlie saying all these words.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: What might the good investment have been?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: If he had a good lead.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: If it was a blackmailer that he could pay up?
MR. RASHBAUM: Objection, leading.
JUDGE EVERETT: Overruled.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Is that correct?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, it is.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right, we talked about the two scenarios.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: The paperwork — what was that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That was the paper that was handed to his mom by the undercover.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: On the Dolce restaurant meeting, we see Charlie Adelson pull out a piece of paper. Was that the actual piece of paper that was handed to his mother?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so. I just never saw it. He never showed it to me.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay. Did he give you a phone number off of that piece of paper?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: That was that phone number that we just can't seem to get right, the 6570 at any time after— I know we talked about the night of the money, but you got the money — but at any time after that, did you ever blackmail Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you ever threaten him in any way?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you relay any threats on behalf of Sigfredo Garcia?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did anyone ever make you extort any money or other favors out of Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Before the murder, had you bragged to Garcia and/or Rivera about "my new rich boyfriend"?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I didn't even know he had money like that.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Well, I mean, he had a good job, and, you know, he had a nice house, but I wasn't aware of how— you know, what, what— how much money he has.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, but he definitely had more than Sigfredo Garcia?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, and did you brag to Garcia like, "Oh, I got a new better guy"?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I'm pretty sure he saw that I was happy, and I was, you know, going out to dinners and hanging out with him, so—
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, but did— did you tell them specifically he's got a lot of money?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you tell them specifically he's got this issue with his sister's ex-husband?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe I mentioned it. Yes, I did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And when you talked to them about "he's got this issue with his sister's ex-husband," was that in the context of hiring them to do the murder, or just in general?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: General.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, so they were aware that he had this issue?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Well, Sigfredo was, yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, did you ever talk to Rivera about it?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, and when you talked to Sigfredo about it, did he ever say, "Well, I think I'll just drive to Tallahassee and kill the guy," or anything like that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am, he did not.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Is that something he would have mentioned to you, if that was his idea?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Sigfredo doesn't say a lot of things to me, so— and he likes to keep a lot of things away from me, so he would have never asked me that or told me that.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, but in this case, I guess— okay, so is it possible that Sigfredo and Rivera came to Tallahassee and did this killing without any communication from you or Charlie Adelson, just on their own?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And then extorted Charlie Adelson through you to get money because they had killed the guy?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, that'd be impossible.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: How would they have any information?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Well, they could have seen it on the internet.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: When you were talking about Wendi's husband and the problems with him to Sigfredo Garcia — I know you've already said this, I just want to be crystal clear — did you say the name Dan Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am. I never knew Dan Markel's name.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: How was the name Dan Markel, the location and name of the target for this killing, provided to the killers?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe it was all the information that was given to Sigfredo, which I got from Charlie, was all in that paper.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Paper provided by this defendant?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am. And the inside, the envelope.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: May I have a moment to confer?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: No further questions.
JUDGE EVERETT: Cross-examination.
MR. RASHBAUM: You were arrested and charged with the murder of Professor Markel on October 1, 2014.
MR. RASHBAUM: I'm sorry, 2016, correct?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Almost immediately, the State talked to your lawyers and offered you full immunity, a get-out-of-jail-free card, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't know if that was immediately.
MR. RASHBAUM: Pretty soon after you got arrested, you were offered to cooperate against Charlie Adelson and the other Adelsons, and you would get to go home to your kids, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And your lawyers told you about that offer?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir, they did.
MR. RASHBAUM: You...
MR. RASHBAUM: You also saw an interview on TV while you were in jail in which one of the prosecutors mentioned this immunity offer, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You have two kids who are your world, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: If you took the state's deal, then you would have been let out of jail immediately, right? That's what your lawyers told you.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: If I took their deal, yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: But you didn't take the offer.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I didn't.
MR. RASHBAUM: Instead, you stayed in jail for three years before your first trial, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You stayed in jail through COVID after your first trial hung.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You still didn't cooperate. Still, the deal was still open, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Well, the deal was to give up Charlie, and you couldn't do that, because in order to give up Charlie, I had to give up Sigfredo, the father of my children, so I couldn't do that.
MR. RASHBAUM: So while you're in jail — sitting in jail during COVID — you knew there was still a deal possibility open for you, right? You could still take a deal. Your lawyers told you that before COVID?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: After my mistrial, yes, I believe so.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you still didn't take the deal, right?
MR. RASHBAUM: Charlie Adelson didn't force you to take the deal — not take the deal, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No. I had no communication with Charlie.
MR. RASHBAUM: He didn't pay for your attorneys.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He didn't pay for my attorneys, but there — there was word that he was — my brother declined him paying for my attorneys, he had anything to do with him.
MR. RASHBAUM: I know you have an agenda here, but just answer my questions.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did Charlie Adelson pay for your attorneys?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, he did not.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did anyone in the Adelson family pay for your attorneys?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No. No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did anyone in the Adelson family pay any money to your kids?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You had nothing to do with Charlie Adelson, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: After the bump?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I did not.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, the real reason you didn't cooperate, and you made it clear, is because Charlie Adelson had absolutely nothing to do with the murder of Professor Markel. Isn't that the case?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I didn't cooperate because in order to give up Charlie, I'd have to give up Sigfredo.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, let's talk about the testimony in your first trial.
MR. RASHBAUM: And don't worry, we're going to get to your proffers as well.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Okay.
MR. RASHBAUM: But let's talk about the testimony in your first trial.
MR. RASHBAUM: You were asked, "Did you get the father of your children, Mr. Garcia, to commit a murder on behalf of Mr. Charlie Adelson?" Answer, "No, ma'am." Do you recall saying that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You were asked, "Can you — do you have information that Charlie Adelson was involved in this?" Answer, "Do I have information? I don't have personal information." Do you recall that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I do not.
MR. RASHBAUM: You don't recall saying that in your first trial?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I do not.
MR. RASHBAUM: Would you like to see a transcript of it?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I will.
MR. RASHBAUM: I'll direct your attention to page 2800, lines 1 through 5.
MR. RASHBAUM: Does... that refresh your recollection that that's what you said?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir, it does.
MR. RASHBAUM: During your second trial, do you — do you recall being asked, "Charlie didn't ask you to do anything weird?" Answer, "No, ma'am." "Like get someone to get a hitman to commit a murder of his ex-brother-in-law?" "No, ma'am." Do you recall those questions and that answer?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir, I do.
MR. RASHBAUM: Because you couldn't implicate Charlie, you went to trial, and the first trial hung. Isn't that the case?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: A few weeks before your second trial, Charlie was arrested.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't that the case?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: The state waited and waited and waited for you to cooperate, and then they arrested them on the eve of your trial when you made it clear you weren't going to cooperate, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: So... you went to trial the second time, and this time you were convicted, and you were convicted of first-degree murder and other charges, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: A few weeks after your conviction, you were sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole plus another 30 years. Do you recall that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: ...from your children. And you realize that there are only two ways to get out of that prison, right? Two... ways. Well, one way was in a coffin, right? And...
MR. RASHBAUM: The other way was cooperating against Charlie Adelson, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir. I wanted the truth to finally come out.
MR. RASHBAUM: What are the only two ways that you can ever get out of prison, Ms. Magbanua?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: My appeal.
MR. RASHBAUM: Oh, well, we'll get to that, too. You have appeal pending right now, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: That claims that you're innocent.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's just make this clear to the jury. Ms.
MR. RASHBAUM: Cappleman has called you as a witness against this man who's presumed innocent.
MR. RASHBAUM: You've just testified that you did a murder, and you have an appeal pending right now in this county claiming your innocence. Isn't that true?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And... lo and behold, weeks after you were convicted and sentenced to life with no parole, you went in and met with the state, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you met with them not once, but twice.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you met with them for hours, combined total of around six hours, right?
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, we're going to get into that and all the lies that Ms. Cappleman didn't go through with you that you made during those interviews. But let's go back to the first trials first.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Okay.
MR. RASHBAUM: In... each of those trials, you took the stand for your own defense, right? And you took the same oath and looked at different jurors the same way that you look today, right? And in your second trial. Not only did you take an oath in this room, but isn't it true that you tried to get Sigfredo to lie for you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I did not.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that you were caught on a recording in the prison in which you were going to have Sigfredo Garcia come into your trial — your second trial — and say that he did the murder with Charlie Adelson all by himself?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I never was on a recording of that fact.
MR. RASHBAUM: Your plan at your second trial wasn't to have Sigfredo Garcia testify on your behalf?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Are you aware that your lawyer opened up on that plan in her opening?
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, did — did you sit through the trial?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir, I did.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you sit through the trial when she said to the jury, "You're going to hear from Sigfredo Garcia, who's going to say that the murder was between him and Charlie Adelson, and that you're just a victim of having bad taste in men"?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He never came up.
MR. RASHBAUM: He refused to come and testify, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't know if he refused. He just never — he was never called.
MR. RASHBAUM: Are you aware that you and your lawyer subpoenaed him to come down to Leon County to testify on your behalf?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He was subpoenaed, but he just never showed up.
MR. RASHBAUM: And he didn't show up. Never took the stand. Right?
MR. RASHBAUM: He was subpoenaed by you, correct?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you got on the phone with him. You were caught because you're not supposed to talk to each other, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: But you guys talk to each other because what you do is, you call his mom, right? And he calls his mom. Is that what you all do?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: At that time, yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Yeah, you call each other so that you could talk to each other through the mom. And during one of those calls, you asked him to come testify on your behalf. Isn't that what you did?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I did not ask him.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay, but we'll move on to some other lies.
MR. RASHBAUM: During your first trial, you were asked, "You didn't ask Mr. Garcia to help this lady get her kids back in Tallahassee?" Answer, "No, ma'am." "You didn't solicit him to commit a murder of Dan Markel?" Answer, "No, ma'am." Do you recall those questions and answers?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You were asked, "Well, back then, did you know someone by the name of Dan Markel?" Answer, "No, ma'am." In 2014, you learned that Wendi Adelson's divorce was already finalized, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I learned that in court. I didn't know it before.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you remember those words? Those were lies, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I lied in my trials to save myself.
MR. RASHBAUM: We'll keep going.
MR. RASHBAUM: You lied when you said that Charlie told you that Professor Markel had been in an accident, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I lied that.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Say it again, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, I'll ask you the questions. Do you remember having a conversation with Charlie Adelson about his brother-in-law being in an accident? Does that sound familiar to you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: It sounds familiar, yeah.
MR. RASHBAUM: That was a lie, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, that's what Charlie said.
MR. RASHBAUM: He told you that he was in an accident, and he'd tell you that there was a murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, he told me he was in an accident.
MR. RASHBAUM: So you didn't know about the murder of Dan Markel on July 18th? Is that what you're telling this jury?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, not at that time.
MR. RASHBAUM: When did you find out about the murder of Dan Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: It was later on.
MR. RASHBAUM: Oh, really? So the money that you brought to the guys that Ms. Cappleman brought up on opening — the money you brought up to the guys on July 19th — it was because Dan Markel was in an accident?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I didn't know that that was Dan Markel. Like, I didn't know his name.
MR. RASHBAUM: Oh.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: But there was a murder that happened, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: At the March 11th dinner that you had with Mr. Lacasse at Yardbird, Dan Markel's name wasn't mentioned?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Would it surprise you that Mr. Lacasse has testified to the opposite of that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I haven't seen his testimony.
MR. RASHBAUM: At — At your first trial, you were asked, "Did Charlie mention anything to you about a murder out of Tallahassee?" — so now it's not Dan Markel, well, it's just a murder out of Tallahassee — and your answer was, "No, ma'am."
MR. RASHBAUM: "Question: Did he mention anything about his ex-brother-in-law being murdered?"
MR. RASHBAUM: "Answer: No, ma'am."
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall those questions?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And those were lies, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I told you I lied. I lied in my trials to save myself.
MR. RASHBAUM: I understand.
MR. RASHBAUM: Please let me keep going through them. There's a lot of them, so we'll take our time.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You said you never saw any cash at Charlie's place. Do you recall that at trial?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He had cash, but I just never — I didn't know how much he had. I know he keeps cash in his safe.
MR. RASHBAUM: But I thought you just testified moments ago that you never saw cash at his place — that he didn't keep cash at his place, that supposedly his parents had to bring the cash. Isn't that what you just told this jury about 18 minutes ago? An abundance of cash?
MR. RASHBAUM: Have you seen his safe?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Have you ever seen it open?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Doesn't he keep a lot of cash that he collects on the top of his safe?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I mean, I'm not, like, looking in it, but every single time we used to go out, he used to grab some money from the safe and then take it with him.
MR. RASHBAUM: Repeatedly during both trials, you said you worked at the Adelson Institute. You never worked at the Adelson Institute, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I did not.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now we're going to hear about a Lexus.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You said you paid for that Lexus. You never paid for that Lexus.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I paid Charlie cash for that Lexus.
MR. RASHBAUM: Really?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. I think the state might disagree. Has the state disagreed with you on that point?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: About me paying him cash? Yes, because there was nothing that was coming out of my account, but I paid him cash.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I had the cash on me.
MR. RASHBAUM: During the trial, the first trial, you were asked, "Do you know why it is that Charlie chose you out of all of his ex-girlfriends to call?"
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: "I don't. I don't know why he called me."
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall those questions?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: That was a lie, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I told you I lied in my first and second trial to save myself.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, let's get to the second trial. Just like you're lying here to save yourself, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I'm not saving myself. I'm telling the truth this time.
MR. RASHBAUM: Right, because now all of a sudden, after eight years, you have developed a conscience. I think that's what you told the jury.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, it's because the father of my children was on death penalty at that time on my first trial. So I couldn't give up. If it was just Charlie, like I said, from the trial, go ahead and arrest him. Nobody ever did.
MR. RASHBAUM: He didn't get the death penalty after the first trial, and he was convicted, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And by the time of his second trial, you had no reason to protect him anymore. He was done.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir. He was under appeal.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. Just like you're under appeal now.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: So, what you said to this jury about 20 minutes ago — is, you said to this jury, "I'm here today to tell the truth," and I want to get your exact words, because — "I want to do the right thing."
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it because you want to go home, and that's the only way that you could ever go home, is to help them?
MR. RASHBAUM: That's the only way you can go home — by not being dead.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I was not promised anything. I'm doing this solely on myself. Clearly, you don't even see my attorneys in this room.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's talk about the second trial.
MR. RASHBAUM: Again, you lied when you testified that you didn't know anything about or were involved in the murder of Professor Markel, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir. I told you I lied in my first and second trial to save myself.
MR. RASHBAUM: Ma'am, we've heard it. If you could just answer the questions. Did you lie?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You lied when you testified that you knew nothing about Wendi's divorce — Wendi Adelson's divorce.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You lied when you said you didn't pick up money from Charlie's house on July 18th.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You lied when you said you knew nothing about stapled cash.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You lied when you said you didn't bring the money to Sigfredo or Luis Rivera the next day.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You lied again when you said you worked as a personal assistant for Charlie, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You lied repeatedly when you tried to discuss what had happened, what was being spoken at Dolce Vita, correct?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: All right, well, now let's talk about the lies that you told that the state didn't go over with you. Let's talk about your proffers, your cooperation.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: So you were interviewed by the state twice in October and November 2022, correct?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And, by the way, you've met with them a couple times since then, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: A couple times.
MR. RASHBAUM: Have you met with them since?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yeah, after that point?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Probably one time.
MR. RASHBAUM: You met with Ms. Cappleman?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did Ms. Cappleman ask you about our defense during that meeting?
MR. RASHBAUM: No, sir — she didn't ask you about whether, for the first time, whether you ever threatened, uh, Charlie Adelson? Now, when you met them — met with them in October and November of 2022 — this was after you got your life sentence, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And, um, you met with them first in Marion County jail on October 11th, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Marion County jail? No, sir, I've never been in that county.
MR. RASHBAUM: You met with them in the jail.
MR. RASHBAUM: I got the wrong jail, obviously.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I've never met with them in any jails.
MR. RASHBAUM: Where did you meet with them the first time?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I was already in DOC in Lowell.
MR. RASHBAUM: You met with them in prison?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Apologies.
MR. RASHBAUM: And the second time, you met with them at the state attorney's office, right? Here in Tallahassee?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And both times, Special Agent Sanford was there?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Investigator Jason Newland was there?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And TPD Investigator Sherry Bennett were there?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And they asked you questions?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And each time you told them a version of events that was very different from what you said at your trials, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: In fact, during those six hours of interviews, you told them about five more versions, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Five different versions of it?
MR. RASHBAUM: Yeah. Oh, so you told him the same thing throughout the six hours that you met with him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so, but I think the first time, you can't even visit more than two hours, so I don't know where you're getting six hours.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, maybe I'm wrong, but let's look.
MR. RASHBAUM: The first interview started at 9:26 a.m. — and it ended at 11:44 a.m., so a little over two hours.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: First interview.
MR. RASHBAUM: Your position right now, what you're telling this jury, is that the same thing you told them in the first interview, you told them in the second interview?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so, yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You believe so or you know so?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I know so.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so. I believe so.
MR. RASHBAUM: You absolutely know so?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I don't. Not verbatim exactly what I said.
MR. RASHBAUM: Is it true that during the entire first interview, you said you had nothing to do with the murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I didn't say that.
MR. RASHBAUM: All right. Well, we're going to go through exact quotes, and we'll see if your memory can be refreshed.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: By the way, during any of these interviews, did you give them any documentation, anything new? Any text messages, documentation, WhatsApps, any new, as people call it, receipts? Did you give them any new evidence?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I'm in prison. I don't have anything.
MR. RASHBAUM: It was just your words, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: So let's talk about what you said during the first proffer, which was a little over two hours. You raised your hand, they put you under oath, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And throughout the proffer, the agents, particularly Special Agent Sanford, kept on telling you that you have to tell the truth, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: He didn't believe you, whatever his reasons are. Was he frustrated with you during the interview?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: In fact, one hour and eight minutes into the proffer, he said to you that you were minimizing your involvement, so—let's—go back. Your position, what you've told this jury, is you—you are completely consistent. You told the same story during the entire proffer, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I can't, like I told you, I can't remember verbatim what I've said from the first proffer and the second proffer.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's just talk about the first proffer.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Your view is that from the beginning of the first proffer to the end of the first proffer, you said the same thing throughout.
MR. RASHBAUM: That's what you're telling this jury.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: From the first proffer to the second proffer that I'm saying the same exact thing, I don't remember verbatim what I've said.
MR. RASHBAUM: How about from the beginning of the first proffer to the end of the first proffer?
MR. RASHBAUM: What you told the jury is you were consistent from the beginning of the first proffer to the end of the first proffer. Do you recall saying that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Is that still your testimony?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That I was consistent about it? No, because it was very hard for me to confess what I've done.
MR. RASHBAUM: So let me ask the question again.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that during the first proffer for the first one hour and eight minutes, you continued to say that you didn't murder Professor Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I didn't say that.
MR. RASHBAUM: I don't understand your answer, so let me rephrase.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Okay.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that for the first half of the first proffer, you denied participation in the murder of Professor Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I was telling him what happened and how my involvement in it.
MR. RASHBAUM: So your position is that throughout the entire first proffer, you admitted that you participated in the murder of Professor Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Judge, may I proceed now?
MR. RASHBAUM: Would it surprise you that one hour and eight minutes into the first proffer, Special Agent Sanford said that you were minimizing your involvement in Professor Markel's murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Like he stated, I was minimizing it. It was hard for me to confess everything that I've suppressed for the past seven years.
MR. RASHBAUM: Eleven minutes later, he said that what you were telling him made absolutely no sense.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall him saying that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I did not.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let me see if I can show you.
MR. RASHBAUM: Does this refresh your recollection that Special Agent Sanford said all of it doesn't make sense?
MR. RASHBAUM: I'm going to try it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Does this refresh your recollection of what Agent Sanford said?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Just the line that you highlighted?
MR. RASHBAUM: You can read before and after to make sure I'm not doing lawyer tricks.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir. Can I?
MR. RASHBAUM: Of course.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, Agent Sanford is saying that, why am I not remembering conversations, specific conversations, and I told him I can't recall those specific conversations.
MR. RASHBAUM: Was he telling you that what you were saying didn't make sense to him?
JUDGE EVERETT: Sustained. Please lay the foundation to impeach specifically.
MR. RASHBAUM: At some point in the interview, did he walk out on you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, he did. On a second interview.
MR. RASHBAUM: Yeah, okay. We're going to get to that. That's like four hours into your combined interviews, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so.
MR. RASHBAUM: Right, so you come back, and I think it's over an hour into the second interview, so actually my math isn't great. It's like three and a half hours into interviewing. Agent Sanford gets so upset— I'll rephrase.
JUDGE EVERETT: He's withdrawing the question. Please move on.
MR. RASHBAUM: Around three hours into these interviews, Agent Sanford decides to leave the room, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: He was frustrated with you, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so.
MR. RASHBAUM: —out. Truthfully, during your first interview, you kept on saying all of these things were jumbled in your head, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You said that about 11 times.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't recall how many times I said it. No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You said that eventually, 33 minutes into the interview, you said you arranged through an envelope that Charlie gave you, but that you never opened it, for Sigfredo to rough up Professor Markel. Do you recall saying that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Repeat the question.
MR. RASHBAUM: 33 minutes into the interview.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You admitted that you arranged through an envelope that Charlie gave you, but that you never opened.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: For Sigfredo to rough up Professor Markel. Do you recall that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I've never said Professor Markel's name.
MR. RASHBAUM: To rough up the deceased.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: What do you mean by that? Can you explain?
MR. RASHBAUM: You told them, 33 minutes into the interview, that Charlie had given you an envelope, that you had never opened, that miraculously got to Sigfredo Garcia, and the purpose of it was to rough up his ex-brother-in-law.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, because I didn't know what the contents of what was in the envelope, so I wouldn't have said that.
MR. RASHBAUM: You said that somehow that plan had transitioned to murder, but according to what you told investigators, you never knew when that happened. Do you recall saying that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Repeat the question again, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You said that somehow the rough-up plan had transitioned to murder.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I never said rough-up or any of those words. That's why it's confusing me.
MR. RASHBAUM: All right, let's say it again.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: You said that somehow the plan had transitioned to murder, but according to what you told investigators, you never knew when that transition happened.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Well, at that time I didn't know.
MR. RASHBAUM: At the time that you were interviewing?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not at my interview, but when it was happening. As they're interviewing me and we're going through the scenario.
MR. RASHBAUM: I'm during your first interview, two hours into it two hours and one minute, to be exact—
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: —that you never spoke to Charlie about the change in plans?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I never spoke to Charlie about the change in plans, meaning it going to become a murder. I'm confused about the questions you're asking. Is this what I said?
MR. RASHBAUM: Yes, what you said to these investigators just a year ago, after you were convicted for life. Didn't you tell investigators you didn't know it was going to be a murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I when we were talking about this, like I said, it was hard for me to confess my involvement in this.
MR. RASHBAUM: Right.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: So you show me where I said this.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's just let's just go with what you just said.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: So two hours into your first interview, when you said this, you still were not admitting that you had a part in the murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, it was very hard for me to do this, especially that they came to me in prison. Where why are all these investigators coming in?
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay, so we are now where we started, which is during this first proffer just a year ago, under oath again, you refused to admit at first that you had anything to do with the murder, that you were a part of the murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir. Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: It's hard for me to admit it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Yes, sir, it is.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: It's still hard for me to admit it right now.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. During your first proffer, nine minutes and 14 seconds into it, do you recall being asked the following questions: "And as you saw in trial, Garcia and Rivera made a trip in June. What can you tell us about that?" Answer: "See, like, like I don't even remember. I mean, obviously, like, you're telling me to like remember from what I heard at trial. I learned a lot of things from trial, that's why it's so hard, and I want to say the right thing, but like I don't remember them going up on a first trip." Do you recall saying that during this proffer?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't recall it. If you could show it to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Does that refresh your recollection that you said that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You were asked during your proffer on page 68, I don't know how long into it, probably about a third into it: Question, "Before that trip, you knew that Louis was going to go with him on that trip?" Answer, "No, I never knew he was going with him." Do you recall answering that way?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: You also said during that proffer, 63 minutes in, that you didn't know Louis Rivera was going on the second trip to Tallahassee. Do you recall saying that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: During that interview on page 83, you told investigators, this is just a year ago, that on the night of July 18th, you didn't know that Charlie's brother-in-law had been shot.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Can you show me that, sir?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Sure. Yes, because I'm emphasizing I don't know Dan Markel.
MR. RASHBAUM: You said that you didn't know that Dan Markel had been shot, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes. Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You told that to investigators a year ago — that that's what — on that night, you had no idea that there was a shooting.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I was partly denying, probably, still my involvement in it.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: This is something I've suppressed for a long time, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, what's also interesting is when you described July 18th, you said Charlie was panicked.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You said he took his Xanax and you took his Xanax.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir. He gave me—
MR. RASHBAUM: You said that he was upset.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I never said he was upset. He was just frantic.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's move on to the second proffer.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: The second proffer was six weeks after the first proffer. Do you recall that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: This is when I came back. I came here, correct?
MR. RASHBAUM: Yes, sir. And you met with investigators for three and a half hours this time, if that's what it says — from 10:06 in the morning to 1:38 in the afternoon.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: At the beginning of the interview, you told investigators you didn't know why you were there, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I didn't know what I got pulled out for.
MR. RASHBAUM: Fifteen minutes into the interview, Agent Sanford left the room, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: He didn't come back?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: During the interview, you were told — do you recall being told — that you weren't giving the state anything to make them want to do anything for you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Repeat that question, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall that during the interview you were told that you weren't giving the state anything to make them want to do anything for you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Who stated that?
MR. RASHBAUM: Investigator Bennett.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Okay. Yes, sir. She — she was upset. I mean, we were just talking about the same thing over again.
MR. RASHBAUM: When she said that, you had a real issue, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not that I can recall.
MR. RASHBAUM: What's the issue? Well, if you didn't help the state and give them something that they could work with, there was only one way you were ever getting out of prison, and that's in a box.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Why do you keep stating that, sir?
MR. RASHBAUM: You're in jail for the rest of your life, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: If the state doesn't help you, the only way you're getting out of prison is when you die.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: But they never said they were gonna help me. I wasn't—
MR. RASHBAUM: That's not my question. What's the only way that you're getting out of prison if the state doesn't help you?
MR. RASHBAUM: During this second proffer, they asked you, "You mean to tell me that you had no clue that he came to Tallahassee?" Answer: "He told me he was not — he never told me he was going to Tallahassee." Do you recall saying that — that you didn't know that Sigfredo Garcia was going to Tallahassee?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir. I never knew he went to Tallahassee.
MR. RASHBAUM: You never knew Sigfredo Garcia went to Tallahassee?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay.
MR. RASHBAUM: During these proffers, you never told the state about monthly payments, did you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Monthly payments?
MR. RASHBAUM: That Charlie was making monthly payments to you.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: What, the checks from the Adelson Institute?
MR. RASHBAUM: Yes.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: They were aware of that.
MR. RASHBAUM: How about the cash he was giving you every month?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He wasn't giving me any cash every month.
MR. RASHBAUM: Oh, really?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: He wasn't giving you $2,000 of cash every single month that you're heard on the wires trying to accept?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: He was just giving you an Adelson Institute check?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Before he gave you the Adelson Institute checks, you were getting $3,000 a month, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: It wasn't until one hour and 13 minutes in the first proffer that you first admitted that you didn't work for the Adelson Institute, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir. I lied about it.
MR. RASHBAUM: In the proffer?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: In the proffer, I don't know when I said it, but I lied in my trials about getting those checks from the Adelson Institute.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I said those were checks that I needed to show so that I can get insurance for my children.
MR. RASHBAUM: You recall them asking you about a meeting with Charlie in the car before Dolce Vita?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you said that you couldn't recall what was discussed?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You recall that during the second proffer, you told the state that you didn't know the police were at your door during the wire? And if you had known they were at the door, you would have let them in?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't think I mentioned it in that way, but they didn't announce themselves when they were knocking on the door.
MR. RASHBAUM: In fact, aren't we going to see in the wires that you were hiding from the police?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I was not hiding. I was at home.
MR. RASHBAUM: Weren't you hiding at home?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: From what? I was working from home that day.
MR. RASHBAUM: Weren't you making a bunch of phone calls to a lot of people saying, "The police are at my door. I don't know what to do. I can't answer the door. I'm afraid"?
MR. RASHBAUM: Weren't you hiding from them?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Somebody was knocking at the door. They didn't state who they were. So I was calling Sigfredo and nobody was picking up. Then one of his coworkers finally called back and said that there's FBI over there speaking to him and he's going to come by the house.
MR. RASHBAUM: And he came by the house?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you all discussed how you were going to stay hidden and not answer the door, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I didn't discuss anything. They just said that there was, like, an FBI agent or an agent outside, so I just decided not to answer the door.
MR. RASHBAUM: And let them in, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No. Why would I let them in?
MR. RASHBAUM: Let me make sure that we're being clear here.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you know that the police were outside your door?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I didn't know who was outside my door. I didn't know until his coworker had stated that there was an undercover or an agent outside.
MR. RASHBAUM: And after he stated that, did you know that there was police outside your door?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: They were gone.
MR. RASHBAUM: Oh, really?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yeah, like, they knocked.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. And then they were gone? You didn't stay hidden for over 45 minutes while these phone calls are happening?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I was at home. I just didn't open the door.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. During the entire first proffer and two-thirds of the second proffer, you never said that Charlie did it or ordered it. Isn't that true?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not specifically, no.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now— Today you come in here and you talk about how on Halloween, Charlie asked you if there was someone who could hurt his ex-brother-in-law, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I stated that on the proffer.
MR. RASHBAUM: That's fine.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: It took you a while to state in the proffer, but I admit you did. Took you about an hour and 40 minutes. But today, that's what your testimony was, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you know that you had only started dating Charlie Adelson about two weeks before Halloween?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: We just started talking. I don't know specifically if it was two weeks.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you know that at the time of Halloween 2013, Charlie Adelson had absolutely no idea anything about your ex?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I wouldn't know, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, let me — let me see if I can refresh your memory.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall text messages in November 27th of 2013 where you said to — okay, please show the witness the document, but let me ask some questions first.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that Charlie Adelson didn't know about your ex until November 27th, 2013?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I wouldn't know, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And even then he didn't know much about him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I wouldn't know.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let me approach with — uh, what number is it? Defense Exhibit 34. You have it. Text messages, these text messages between you and Charlie. Does that refresh your recollection that he didn't know about your ex until the earliest November 27, 2013?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Halloween's in October, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now— You talk about this letter and Charlie printing it up. In all the times in Charlie's house, you ever see — does he have a computer? He doesn't own a computer, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He had a little office in his — in his house, but I don't know if there was a computer or not. I don't recall.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall during these interviews that the investigators kept on pushing you whether Charlie gave you money during the trips?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Repeat the question, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall during these interviews that the investigators kept on pushing you, asking you a lot of questions about whether Charlie Adelson gave you any money before the two men took the trips?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, and I answered them.
MR. RASHBAUM: I know you did. Okay. And it took you 22—minutes left in the second proffer where you finally said he gave us — he gave him — he gave you a few hundred dollars for each trip.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Repeatedly before then, you couldn't even remember that, right? You were confused, as you said it.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I could remember it. It was just very hard when I was speaking, especially when I was speaking with Sanford in the room because he was frustrated with me.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: So once he left the room, it was an easier conversation to have, and I wasn't so pressured.
MR. RASHBAUM: It was an easier conversation to have because, in fact — in fact, Investigator Bennett started to play the part of Katie Magbanua, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't know what you mean by that, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, she started to testify for you.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, she did not.
MR. RASHBAUM: It wasn't mostly her talking and you saying yes?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that it wasn't until an hour and 16 minutes and 31 seconds into the second proffer where you were still continuing to say that you didn't become aware that this was going to be a murder until sometime between the first and second trips to Tallahassee?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir. I told you, it was very hard for me to admit my part in all of this. I'm sorry.
MR. RASHBAUM: So four hours into your proffers, you were still saying that you didn't know the first trip was for a murder. That's fair to say, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: All— All right, let's go on to a little different subject.
MR. RASHBAUM: You started dating Sigfredo Garcia just after high school?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: By the time you broke up with him, you had been with Sigfredo on and off for more than a decade.
MR. RASHBAUM: By the way, when you dated Charlie Adelson, he thought you were broken up with Sigfredo Garcia, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I was broken up with him.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, did you have sexual relations with Sigfredo Garcia while dating Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I did.
MR. RASHBAUM: Charlie didn't know that, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I mean, that's — that's not something I would tell him.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you considered him to be your husband.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You met Charlie Adelson at work.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: At a place called SoFi Dental — sorry, SoFi Dental.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And that was in South Beach.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you started dating in the middle of October of 2013.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: In the middle of October?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, we started dating before that.
MR. RASHBAUM: When did you start dating?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't recall the exact date, but it was definitely before October.
MR. RASHBAUM: If I told you... Do you recall that your first date was at a restaurant kind of in the building?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: If I told you that the date of that was October 9th, would that refresh your recollection? Could that be right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Possibly, yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: When you dated Charlie Adelson, he treated you well?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: I think you said you didn't know he had money. You knew he had money.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I mean, he wasn't very flashy with it. I know he was well off.
MR. RASHBAUM: He took you to nice dinners?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: That was different than your past relationship, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I've been to nice dinners with Sigfredo.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did Charlie treat you nicer than Sigfredo?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I wouldn't say that he treated me nicer at that time, yes, because I was going through a lot with Sigfredo.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did Charlie ever lay hands on you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did Sigfredo?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: We've gotten into arguments, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: One where he ripped off your necklace?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, he's never ripped off any necklace of mine. No.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, at first, Charlie was the pursuer. Is that fair to say? He pursued you.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Over time, you became more serious.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so.
MR. RASHBAUM: And he made it clear to you over time, namely in the spring of 2014, that he didn't want anything different than casual, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I mean, I think we were both in agreement with that, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: But you had questions about it. You asked him, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so.
MR. RASHBAUM: And he told you, "I like the way things are."
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, Sigfredo came to know that you were dating Charlie, correct?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And during — your second trial, you testified that you told Sigfredo about Charlie to make Sigfredo mad.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Probably.
MR. RASHBAUM: You wanted to throw it in his face that you were dating a successful dentist, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That I was dating somebody, period, because I never really dated anybody after Sigfredo.
MR. RASHBAUM: Sigfredo hated Charlie.
MR. RASHBAUM: You told Charlie on one occasion, if you see him, run.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't that what you told him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not that I can recall, no.
MR. RASHBAUM: Is it possible that you told him that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, but he would be scared of Sigfredo, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Sigfredo considered you the love of his life, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so.
MR. RASHBAUM: He made it clear to you that he wanted you back and didn't want you to be with Charlie, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: It's not that he made it clear, but we were trying to work it out for our family.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, Charlie talks a lot, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, he does.
MR. RASHBAUM: And he repeats himself over and over.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: As a traveling periodontist, he's in the car a lot for work, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And what does he do when he's in the car a lot?
MR. RASHBAUM: Talks on the phone?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Talk on the phone, yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And he'd call you a lot on the phone, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He would at that time, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And at that time, he would sometimes call you early in the morning, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: He'd call you sometimes in his breaks at work.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: He'd call you late at night.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, we were dating.
MR. RASHBAUM: Exactly. He'd talk to you a ton.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: He talks to his mom a lot on the phone too, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, you witnessed it, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: You would be with him a lot when he would talk to his mom, right? On the phone.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And by the way, you talk on the phone a lot with Sigfredo Garcia, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And that makes sense because he's the father of your two children, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, in 2014, you became aware of Charlie's family issues, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: You heard him talking on the phone a lot to his mom, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yeah, he's always talking to his mom.
MR. RASHBAUM: And also, when you guys would go out, as you — you know, Charlie likes to talk, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And so a topic of frequent conversation would be what he had just talked to his mom about, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, he never told me what he was talking to his mom about.
MR. RASHBAUM: No? So he never told you about the problems that his sister was having? He wouldn't recount those conversations that he was having with his mom?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not when he's on the phone with his mom. Maybe if we're just, you know, laying down or and talking, he'd mention it once in a blue moon.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you would — would ask him questions about it, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not really. He —
MR. RASHBAUM: — told you about this "TV was cheaper than a hit man" joke many times, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, he's made that comment before.
MR. RASHBAUM: And he repeated it to many people, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir, he has.
MR. RASHBAUM: He makes a lot of bad jokes, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, he does.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did — you ever tell him, "Charlie, why are you making that joke when we're actually hiring a hit man? Like, don't you think that's a bad idea?" Did you ever say that to him?
MR. RASHBAUM: Because he feels like he's untouchable?
MR. RASHBAUM: No, because you really weren't hiring a hitman. He didn't know he was hiring a hitman, right? That's why you didn't tell him that, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: He knew he was hiring a hitman.
MR. RASHBAUM: So — when he made that joke in front of Professor Lacasse on March 11th at Yardbird, that he made that joke. Yeah, you know, he made the joke at that dinner, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't recall that. No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Unless I was talking to Wendi and I didn't pay attention to what they were talking about.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, let's talk about that dinner a little bit. On March 11th, just six weeks before the first attempt that in your proffers you didn't know about, you — all ate outside on the patio.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: And during this dinner, you and Wendi talked a lot about your exes, didn't you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not that we talked a lot about the exes. I always speak of my children, so I'm pretty sure I mentioned my kids and she mentioned her kids.
MR. RASHBAUM: You didn't probe information from Wendi about her ex?
MR. RASHBAUM: That's why you brought up your exes?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir. We did not talk about any exes.
MR. RASHBAUM: Were you aware that Sigfredo and Luis Rivera were sitting in a car scoping you out?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I didn't know that until my trial.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, the state showed you a picture of you on the beach with Wendi Adelson.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: No discussion about a murder plot during that.
MR. RASHBAUM: The jet ski incident — was Charlie scared?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Were you upset?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Of course.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did it cause a whole string of text messages and fights between you and Sigfredo?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: After that incident, yes.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: You were afraid that Charlie was going to break up with you, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not really.
MR. RASHBAUM: Really? Your text messages don't show that you were upset that Charlie might break up with you? That Sigfredo was trying to run your life?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Well, I was upset, but I didn't really care if Charlie was going to break up with me or not.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, I want to take you to the week of the murder.
MR. RASHBAUM: And we'll start with July 14th.
MR. RASHBAUM: You had dinner with Charlie the night of July 14th, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not that I can recall.
MR. RASHBAUM: Oh, you don't recall having dinner with him the night of July 14th?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Are you sure you didn't have dinner with him the night of July 14th?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I can't recall. If you'd show me something.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall him working late and coming towards your house and meeting him at a place near the water on July 14th?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, let's do it this way. If you had dinner with him on July 14th — just four days before the murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you pick up money from him at that point in time?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, because I don't even remember that dinner.
MR. RASHBAUM: Assuming that the dinner happened.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Which I think the state's going to prove.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. Did you pick up any money from him at that dinner?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't even recall that dinner.
MR. RASHBAUM: Fair enough.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall having lunch with him on July 17th, the day before the murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Let me try to refresh your memory on this.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall on July 16th that Charlie worked late and went out to dinner with Erica Johnson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I can't recall.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall that you got in a fight with him that night because you thought he might be cheating on you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I don't recall it.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall that there are text messages in which you were upset that he was out so late? You don't recall that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir. Do you have something to show me?
MR. RASHBAUM: I don't need to. Do you recall that he told you on that call that he had worked late, that he had gone out with Erica, and that he would have a lunch with you the next day?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't recall any of those days, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall that on the call on that night — the evening of the 16th, it's actually the very morning of the 17th, it's after midnight — that you were adamant that you wanted to have dinner with him on the 18th?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir, I don't remember any of those days.
MR. RASHBAUM: That's why you don't remember that. It's fine, show me. The answer is you don't remember that, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I can't recall.
MR. RASHBAUM: I get to ask the questions.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay? Yes, that's how this works.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now — you went to lunch with him near his house. Do you recall that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: One moment.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall going to Vila's? It's like a Cuban-Mexican place right by Charlie's house.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I know of the restaurant, but I don't remember the date when we went. You know, we've been there before, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: You don't recall going there the day before the murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Nonetheless, if you had been there, you didn't collect any money that day, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Do you recall that during that lunch, you got in a big fight?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: During what lunch?
MR. RASHBAUM: The lunch on the 17th that you don't remember.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: How can I tell you what happened if I don't remember the date and you're not showing me anything?
MR. RASHBAUM: Let's talk about after the murder.
MR. RASHBAUM: One moment, Your Honor.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that Charlie Adelson gave you $138,000 the night of the murder, not $100,000?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I never counted the money.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that you were paid $3,000 every month after the murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that you told Charlie Adelson that a terrible thing had happened, your friend got an idea to do this, you didn't know anything about it, but you would help him?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Repeat that question, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that you told Charlie Adelson that a friend of yours had done this, that you had talked too much, but that you would do everything you could to help Charlie Adelson?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Isn't it true that you told him that if he ever went to the police, these people would do to him and his family what they had done to Professor Markel?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: If the state proves that for the next 20 months you received payments, does the state have it wrong?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: That I received payments? For the next 20 months after July 18th, if the state proves, they're going to bring up a financial person who's going to show cash payments.
MR. RASHBAUM: When the state proves that, do they have it wrong?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, because I deposit it throughout every month.
MR. RASHBAUM: The payments that Charlie was making to you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, what Sigfredo had given to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Is it true that you were the mastermind behind Professor Markel's murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, sir. That was Charlie.
MR. RASHBAUM: I'm sure it was.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I didn't have any information on Mr. Markel.
JUDGE EVERETT: Do not volunteer information. Wait for a question, respond accordingly to the question.
MR. RASHBAUM: By the way, on these wires that we're going to hear, you're repeatedly lying to Charlie, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Repeatedly lying about what?
MR. RASHBAUM: Well, you're telling him that you're calling the undercover number, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I lied to him.
MR. RASHBAUM: You never called the undercover number.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, because I was telling Sigfredo to call that number.
MR. RASHBAUM: Ma'am, let me ask the questions.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I'm asking.
MR. RASHBAUM: I know you have an agenda, but let me ask the questions.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Objection. Move to strike. Argument.
JUDGE EVERETT: Sustained. I'd ask the jury to disregard the last comment about any agendas. Please continue.
MR. RASHBAUM: On those wires, you tell Charlie Adelson that you've called the undercover number, don't you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I said that.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you never called the undercover number.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Of course. Why would I call it?
MR. RASHBAUM: You tell Charlie Adelson that you tried to call the number.
MR. RASHBAUM: But it's a non-working number. Do you recall saying that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And that was a lie?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, we were all lying to each other.
MR. RASHBAUM: Your call, Judge.
JUDGE EVERETT: She's responding to your question. You don't have to like the answer.
MR. RASHBAUM: I actually love it.
MR. RASHBAUM: You never lied to Sigfredo on those wires, did you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, I did.
MR. RASHBAUM: When did you lie to Sigfredo on those wires?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Well, he was lying to me, actually.
MR. RASHBAUM: I asked a different question.
MR. RASHBAUM: When did you lie to Sigfredo on those wires? Give me one example of lying to Sigfredo.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: You're right. I'm stating that Sigfredo was lying to me.
MR. RASHBAUM: Ms. Magbanua, I'm going to ask the question one more time.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, I didn't lie to Sigfredo.
MR. RASHBAUM: You never once lied to Sigfredo Garcia on those wires.
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Not that I can recall, no.
MR. RASHBAUM: But you repeatedly lied to Charlie Adelson on those wires, didn't you?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir, I did.
MR. RASHBAUM: By the way, you and Sigfredo Garcia talked about how you needed to get a burner phone, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, Sigfredo was the one who got the burner phones.
MR. RASHBAUM: Okay. You and Sigfredo got burner phones, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Sigfredo bought the burner phones, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And you used a burner phone, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, he advised me to do so.
MR. RASHBAUM: Did you ever talk to Charlie Adelson about getting a burner phone?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I wasn't aware, but I thought he had one.
MR. RASHBAUM: You told Charlie Adelson that Sigfredo Garcia left a voicemail for the undercover. You recall telling him that?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe so, yes.
MR. RASHBAUM: And that was a lie?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I believe Sigfredo did leave a voicemail to the undercover.
MR. RASHBAUM: You think he did, or you think they just heard about the voicemail, that he actually never called the undercover?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: If he said he did, he probably did.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, shortly after the murder, you and Charlie break up, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: Like immediately after?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: I don't know if it's immediately after, but we stopped, you know, hanging out as much.
MR. RASHBAUM: Now, you keep on saying that the state hasn't promised you anything, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, sir.
MR. RASHBAUM: But you're hoping that they're going to help you, right?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Of course. I want to see my children again.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Redirect examination.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I'm going to present you with the text message exhibit that the defense showed you. Thank you.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Maybe.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: I misunderstood, but is this text showing that the — defendant found out about Sigfredo in November, or that Sigfredo found out about the defendant in November?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: From the text messages, it's that Sigfredo found out about Charlie.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: All right.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: The job in this case — there's some question about, is it to harm, is it to rough up, is it to kill? What was the job?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: It was to kill.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And you knew it was to kill?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Those exact words weren't mentioned, but yes.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did you know that this was going to result in a death?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Not a roughing up?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Okay, and I know you don't — do you know precisely when you found out it was going to be a death?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: No, ma'am.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: But can you tell us, generally, it was definitely before the murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Before July.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: And did Charlie Adelson know it was a murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, he did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: Did Sigfredo Garcia know it was a murder?
KATHERINE MAGBANUA: Yes, ma'am, he did.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: No further questions.
JUDGE EVERETT: You may step down. Will the witness be recalled at any point?
MS. CAPPLEMAN: She could be judge. I would ask that she remain under the rule.
JUDGE EVERETT: Very well. Please approach.
JUDGE EVERETT: We'll take a break before we call the next witness.
JUDGE EVERETT: The bailiff will escort you into the jury room.
JUDGE EVERETT: We'll take a five-minute recess.
MS. CAPPLEMAN: State's 127.